I am so fucking sick of teaching our daughters not to get raped
Trigger warning* I’m talking about rape and I’m fucking pissed off..
Never take a drink from anyone or let your drink out of your sight. Don’t show too much cleavage. Be aware of your surroundings at all times. Never go to a boy’s room alone. If it comes to it, go for the eyes, the nose, the balls. Always stay with a group of girls…safety in numbers. You can’t trust him, even if he seems nice.
These are all the rules I was taught growing up. Parents, teachers, media, all told me I had to be careful not to get raped. Because I was a girl. And the responsibility was on me.
I’m so fucking sick of it.
I don’t have daughters that have to be taught these rules. I have sons. Three sons. And instead, I will teach them what seems like a pretty basic concept that should be taught to all sons: DON’T RAPE PEOPLE!
Like everyone else, I’ve followed the Steubenville rape trial with horror and disgust. My horror and disgust is directed toward Michael Nodianos, who spent twelve minutes entertaining his friends with jokes about the rape they had all just witnessed. My horror and disgust is directed toward Mark Cole II who shot a video of his friend raping someone and didn’t see anything wrong with it until the next day. My horror and disgust is directed toward Evan Westlake and Cody Saltsman and Anthony Craig and every other person who was witness to and complicit in the RAPE of a 16 year old girl and instead of stopping it, saw fit to shoot photos, video and share to social media. My horror and disgust is directed toward Trent Mays and Ma’lik Richmond, the two boys who MADE A DECISION to haul an incapacitated girl from party to party for use as an object of humiliation and degradation. The two boys who MADE A DECISION to repeatedly penetrate a barely conscious girl (if she was conscious at all). The two boys who MADE A DECISION for a girl who didn’t have a say in the matter.
Never, at any point in following this story, did I stop and think, “Man…that sucks for those rapists.”
You know why? Because they are rapists. Yes, they are young. Yes, they are stupid. Yes, they made a mistake. Yes, they had good grades. Yes, they were athletes. Yes, they are someone’s sons. Yes, they have fucked up their futures. Not a single one of those facts excuses them from the consequences of raping someone.
There seems to be some sort of fucked up public opinion that we should pity these boys because, hey, we all do dumb stuff when we’re young. Because it could have been our sons. And to that I say, bullshit.
We need to stop letting it be our sons.
We need to teach our sons that no means no. And that silence means no. And that drunkenness means no. And that being passed out means no. And that “I don’t know” or “I’m not sure” or “maybe we shouldn’t do this” means no.
We need to teach our sons that women and girls are actual people. They’re not just bodies. They’re not just holes. They’re not inanimate objects to be used at will.
We need to teach our sons that degrading women isn’t funny in any context.
We need to teach our sons that watching something happen and not intervening is every bit as bad as participating.
We need to teach our sons what it means to be men.
I don’t have any daughters. I am not tasked with teaching them how to try not to get raped. But this isn’t a problem with our daughters. We shouldn’t have to teach them how to stop rape.
We need to teach our sons.
*UPDATED* Comment moderation policy: While I’m all for civil discourse and voices of dissent, I will no longer publish comments that are name calling or off topic. Be respectful of each other.
Posted under Shit I actually wrote instead of just transcribing what my kid said by Laugh, Mom
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This is perfect.
by: Heather, Mar 18th at 5:37 pm
I don’t have to read any of this,but in my opinion,and since I was a victim of rape years ago,men and women are victims of this horrid crime. they should be taught as they are growing up to respect the opposite sex always.
by: Myra Robinson, Mar 22nd at 3:35 am
I don’t have to read any of this,but in my opinion,and since I was a victim of rape years ago,men and women are victims of this horrid crime. they should be taught as they are growing up to respect EVERYONE, always.
Fixed that for you.
by: Blair, Mar 22nd at 5:31 pm
We teach our daughters to be safe…..because there are parents who do not teach their sons to be respectful of girls/women. People may be tired of having to do that…..but we live in this real world, and must do that.
by: Lisa, Apr 10th at 1:19 pm
Could not have said it any better. So true.
by: Lori, Apr 10th at 9:52 pm
As a mother of 2 daughters, I agree with you completely Lisa. While I have sons that I have taught to be respectful as well, it has not changed the fact that I have taught my daughters all that they need to know and do to keep themselves safe. Ironic that when I was in high school, I had to keep a friend `safe`from the `jocks with good grades`, after they attempted to get us girls drunk until we passed out. Thankfully, I had a feeling what they were up to and kept sober. Sad that after 30 years, the mentality of some horny teenaged boys hasn`t changed as much as it should have by now.
by: Dianne, Apr 12th at 12:15 am
I grew up in a home where my father felt that it was ok for boys to sow their wild oats until I reminded him that the girl they were sowing their wild oats with was someone’s daughter and how would he feel if it was me that they were sowing their oats..changed his mind quickly…and I raised 3 sons who know better than to hurt a woman in any way form or reason.
by: Nancy, Apr 12th at 10:46 pm
couldn’t have said it any better!!
by: Rose, Mar 18th at 6:07 pm
Let’s teach our kids (our daughters and our sons because why treat them so differently?) to both protect themselves and not to harm others.
by: James, Mar 19th at 3:05 pm
Why treat them differently? Because in this case we are talking about RAPE. Because in this case we are talking about the mentality that women or girls have to be the ones to prevent RAPE. Because in this case a whole community has personified that mentality and a 16 year old GIRL was mercilessly raped and degraded by a group of BOYS. Because in this case TWO TEENAGED GIRLS have been charged with threatening this RAPE VICTIM. Because in this case CNN has further victimized this young GIRL by throwing their support behind these BOYS who should be now referred to as RAPISTS. Because GIRLS have to be made of “Sugar and Spice and Everything Nice” and BOYS will always “be boys”. Because we live in a society that for all it’s “advancements” women and girls are still being victimized, stigmatized and blamed for being raped.
I have a son and a daughter. I am teaching them both what you suggest, but just because I adore my son does not mean I am not aware of the fact that he has the power to hurt someone in this manner. I am not offended at the call for better teaching of RAPE and CONSENT and DIGNITY and RESPECT of women to our boys and happily neither is my husband.
by: Erica, Mar 19th at 4:23 pm
Haha, if you read their reply you’d see you two are saying the same thing. “Teach our kids to protect each other and not harm others” – that’s pretty legit! I see no difference between that and what you claim to be teaching your son and daughter. Your second paragraph makes sense. Let me see if I understand your first:
So, in order to stop society from treating women and men differently (in regards to rape) we must treat men and women differently when it comes to rape?
I’m not getting that.
by: A man, Mar 24th at 8:38 am
This is why we need to treat them differently : “…91% of United States people whose rape accusations resulted in convictions against the accused were female and 9% were male. It also stated that 99% of the people convicted of and imprisoned in response to rape accusations were male, with only 1% of those convicted being female..”. That is from the US Bureau of Justice Statistics.
by: Lacy MacDougall, Mar 19th at 5:01 pm
Although those are sad statistics, they are not the reality. Most males won’t report rape for reasons they think are “girly”, “weak”, etc. I’ve been through this, I’ve seen my nephew go through this. It happens on both sides and it is sick. Girls and boys should be taught to respect ALL people.
by: Tera Carvalho, Apr 11th at 1:01 am
I have three daughters. I will teach them all the bullshit ways to not get raped which in the end did not keep me safe from getting raped. I will teach them to rail against the things that they know to be wrong. I will teach them to help their friends, boys or girls, to not make decisions that they will regret for a lifetime. I will teach them that rape is real. I hope they’ll meet a life filled with boys raised by people like you.
by: Amanda, Mar 18th at 6:34 pm
I have 3 daughters, and a son. This is spot on and amazing. Thank you for writing it and being brave enough to speak for sons and daughters everywhere.
by: Samantha Millus, Mar 18th at 6:52 pm
This? I love!
by: Niri, Mar 18th at 8:16 pm
Wow. Couldn’t have said it better. I have both a son AND a daughter. And I’ll teach them both.
by: Erin, Mar 18th at 8:21 pm
Just shared everywhere. I have three daughters. I want them to know your sons. I love every damn word of this. Thank you for writing it.
by: tracy@sellabitmum, Mar 18th at 8:21 pm
I totally agree with you and believe you are spot-on, but why the need to be foul-mouthed just for emphasis? What’s up with that? Are you teaching your daughters that too?
by: Kim, Mar 18th at 8:25 pm
Who cares! See that’s the thing about this site. Its HER blog and she can write what she wants. You have the option to read or not. It is truly disgusting the things that we have to go through to keep our children safe that should be common sense.
She (along with every other parent) has a right to be fucking pissed off!
by: Dawn @ Life Unscripted, Mar 18th at 8:34 pm
In this instance I do not view the profanity used as a reflection of the writer’s character but rather a reflection of the strong emotion that this entire episode triggers. For this individual, it is an emotion that deserves the strongest most shocking expression of protest, which has successfully caused you to stop, and read her commentary.
by: estelle, Mar 21st at 6:25 pm
How can you say…who cares????The discussion is rape and you say who cares? you need serious help dawn! Maybe you are covering up for something one of your kids did? Talking about keeping kids safe would mean rape is an issue! what the hell is wrong with you????????????
by: Lauren`, Mar 22nd at 3:17 am
Lauren,I think she’s saying “who cares” to the foul language, not the topic.
by: Glenda, Mar 22nd at 1:40 pm
Lauren, I think you missed something.
by: Doug, Mar 23rd at 9:23 pm
Seriously? That’s what you got from this?
by: Jen B, Mar 18th at 8:39 pm
Don’t read it if it offends you…..just move on with your life…if you have one
by: Reelitz mom, Mar 18th at 9:32 pm
Did you miss the part where she said she didn’t have daughters?! if you’re going to insult her parenting, you might want to get it right.
by: Li, Mar 18th at 9:40 pm
Kim…obviously you saw nothing in this post but what you wanted to see. As evidenced by the fact that the writer has SONS and not DAUGHTERS which she CLEARLY stated.
by: Bb, Mar 18th at 9:41 pm
Her message is should what be offends you, not her curse words. Her curse words are to get the worlds attention. I am a person who doesn’t mind curse words , used for good causes.
by: Reecie, Mar 19th at 6:19 am
no need for the tone argument. they’re just words. for emphasis. no need to clutch pearls over it.
by: KS, Mar 19th at 3:04 pm
i cuss. i cuss in front of my children. not all the time but if i say it i own up to it. i also tell them that that language is not accepted in typical society and if they speak they way people will view them in a certain fashion. a lot like how they view me.
now if that is your hangup from this very well done article then you need some help my friend. rape happens. when we allow ourselves to talk honestly and openly on issues like this and help the ones that need help (offenders and victims. sorry but i feel a offender needs to understand that is wrong. still punish). we can not put our heads in the sand no longer
by: chris, Mar 20th at 7:38 pm
I am a mother of six and a grandmother of 10. I have always warned everyone in my life that if you hear me use the “F” word you better run real fast. This is not something I would normally post on my facebook wall but I get it…I won’t add why.
by: Rosemary, Mar 21st at 6:32 pm
Why use the profanity? Probably because it’s the only way to get people’s attention anymore. It’s sad that society is at the point it is. I have an average daughter and a son with intense special needs. I fear for them both. And that fear is of danger from both other boys AND girls.
More people need to be incensed about things like this, and if a few cuss words are what it takes to make people notice, good on her. I intentionally do not share things with profanity in it, since my daughter is 9 and doesn’t need to read that, but this? This I will share.
by: Jennifer, Apr 9th at 9:05 pm
they say people who cuss, r thee most honest people in our world
by: shirley cameron, Apr 11th at 2:40 pm
@ Kim – Guess what Kim? I HAVE TAUGHT MY KIDS TO SWEAR! I HAVE TAUGHT THEM TO USE IT IN CONTEXT AND AT APPROPRIATE TIMES! DEAL WITH IT!!!!!! Little Pollyannas who believe that we should all say “gosh” and “darn” and “oh my” are living in the 1950′s. Guess what – this is 2013 and this is the real world. Profanity is here to stay, and I for one make no apologies for using it!!!! If you can’t handle that, best close your ears!
by: Mom of Two Boys, Apr 11th at 3:33 pm
I’m so pissed off about this issue that I wrote something in a similar tone a few weeks ago:
https://www.facebook.com/notes/sharon-harris/happy-fucking-international-womens-day/10151785193305299
I got so fucking angry when I heard that kids in a JUNIOR school were using the word, “rape,” to mean “win.”
by: Sharon, Apr 12th at 1:18 am
Who the fuck cares about tone? We’re talking about the mass oppression of half the world’s population. I’m mad as fuck and I want to scream it to the world. Manners go out the window when our young girls are being raped by boys so animalistic they think rape is normal. Fuck anyone who doesn’t like the tone of this article or my post. Fuck you, fuck sexist men fuck rape, fuck the world for not caring, fuck women for staying quiet when they should be outraged, fuck all of it. Get mad and maybe something will finally get done
by: Lily, Apr 12th at 6:27 am
I was molested as a child and I praise you for your post. It sucks that we have to warn our daughters and drill it into our sons. You worded this perfect!!
by: Dawn @ Life Unscripted, Mar 18th at 8:31 pm
Amen! This whole story is disgusted and truth be told, these animals got off easy. If I had any say in it they would have been tossed in jail with their other pedos and rapists.
by: Cat Davis, Mar 18th at 8:36 pm
Are you implying you’d like them to be raped? Fun moral roller-coaster you’re riding, but it doesn’t look like I’m high enough to join. I mean, wow, look at it logically for one second, if you care about society you would hope for the rehabilitation of those criminals, especially since a vast majority of perpetrators of sexual violence have themselves been victims of it.
by: A man, Mar 24th at 8:43 am
I believe Mrs. Davis made a clear statement, void of any implication.
“If I had any say in it they would have been tossed in jail with the other pedos and rapist.”
That is because these rapist are let off with a slap on the wrist. Logically speaking you shouldn’t have to teach girls how to “herd protect” themselves. You shouldn’t have to actively teach boys that rape is wrong. You SHOULD have more support for the victims then the perpetrators.
by: A better Man, Apr 11th at 1:20 pm
These people didn’t rape this girl because they were victims of pedophiles!!! This was not a SEX thing; this was a POWER thing. They stopped viewing this girl (and probably most girls) as an ‘IT,’ instead of as a human being. Our society is rapidly becoming one that is completely devoid of empathy and respect for human life. “Rehabilitation?” How about “Restitution, Resolution, Reconciliation?” (Barbara Coloroso) These people ALL (witnesses included) need to be acquainted with the fact that human beings ALL deserve dignity and respect. I agree that perhaps a natural consequence for what they did would be to be thrown in with others who have the same mentality as they do. Perhaps that’s how they’ll gain some empathy for the girl they dehumanized. And THAT’S what they did. They DEHUMANIZED her.
by: Joscelynne, Apr 11th at 2:36 pm
You have written what has been in my head for so long….Thank You. What a disservice we do to our sons when we don’t teach them HOW to be men. It shouldn’t be that difficult. And sorry Kim, but sometimes, “Gosh darn it, I’m mad” isn’t enough. SOMETIMES, a “I’m fucking pissed” is 100% needed..THIS is one of those times.
by: Tonya, Mar 18th at 8:38 pm
You said it all and so perfectly. Every parent of a boy should have this talk. It should start as soon as puberty takes hold. And it should be reinforced constantly. I don’t feel bad for those boys at all. I feel absolutely terrible about what happened to that girl.
by: Jennifer Wagner, Mar 18th at 8:40 pm
Actually, it doesn’t need to wait till puberty. Women (and girls) are people. Everyone’s body is their own. If someone says no, stop what you’re doing. These are lessons toddlers can – and do – learn. I loved this article: http://www.csmonitor.com/The-Culture/Family/Modern-Parenthood/2013/0318/Steubenville-rape-trial-How-can-I-raise-my-boy-not-to-rape-nor-be-a-bystander
by: Liz, Mar 19th at 4:09 pm
I agree – my daughters are 5 & 8, and I have been vigilant since they were able to understand, that when someone is tickling/hugging and you say STOP, that person needs to STOP. I also run a home daycare, and kids as young as 18 months are able to understand this concept. I teach them daily that their bodies are their own, and I teach both sides – you have the power to say no or get help if someone is doing something to you that you don’t like, and on the flip side, if you are doing something and a person says “STOP”, you MUST STOP.
by: sara, Apr 11th at 3:49 pm
I’m too emotional to say anything other than “Yes. THAT is how I feel. “
by: Laura, Mar 18th at 8:44 pm
Yes, this, times one billion.
by: Angie [A Whole Lot of Nothing], Mar 18th at 8:48 pm
I have 3 daughters. One of them is 17 and has a friend who is a boy. They are “serious”. I worry so much about mixed signals, or just him being an idiot.
Every word of this is perfect, even the cursewords. Bless you heart for posting it.
by: Lance, Mar 18th at 8:50 pm
Then sit the boy down and put the fear of God into him. It’s your duty as her father.
by: Bobbie Helland, Mar 18th at 10:36 pm
What the fuck does *that* mean? Like you can’t respect a person’s autonomy without bringing religion into it!? That a boy can’t respect a girl unless he’s terrified of some damnation, and not just because he might actually be a good person? Good grief.
by: M, Mar 18th at 11:23 pm
It means scare the shit out of him. And I agree. If you force yourself upon my daughter then I am going to break your fucking neck? You have a problem with that? Fear is a good thing.
by: JR, Mar 19th at 12:50 am
Wow, wrong.
You don’t tell a boy he can’t hurt a girl because if he does bad things will happen to him.
You tell him you don’t hurt a girl because that is a horrible thing to do to another person.
by: Anna, Mar 22nd at 6:54 am
….someone has to stick up for our daughters because people like you surely won’t….
by: JR, Mar 19th at 12:52 am
Wow it’s people like you that are a large part of the problem. Overly feminist women who have grown to despise men and distrust them in every aspect of life. What makes you think he was going to force himself upon her in the first place? Just act like a deranged over protective parent just in case someone might be a rapist? Dear lord what the hell is the world coming to??
by: Dooley, Mar 19th at 1:59 pm
Lets turn this the other way round for a second, say your the lads father and your afraid the girl he is getting ‘serious’ with is going to hurt him in some manner. I take from your comment it is perfectly acceptable for him to threaten your daughter with physical violence and do his best to intimate the girl just on the off chance she might hurt his son.
You can see it now the headlines the outcry about a poor girl being bullied. You know what the outcry would be right! But equally the outcry should be the same about a boy or man getting threatened in this manner. But if the lad tried to complain he wouldn’t get any sympathy he’d get told to ‘man up’. This is the other often forgotten side of sexism This is the aspect of ‘feminism’ I hate, the equality gets forgotten. There is too much man hating and too little looking at the bigger picture it’s shocking
by: Dave, Mar 19th at 4:50 pm
Indeed. There is no need for the threat of or actual violence to enter into either side of the equation. If men can’t be taught to respect women without the looming threat of violence (or if that is the only reason they pretend to respect them) then heaven help us all. “Putting the fear of God” into young men only perpetuates a culture of violence and does nothing to increase genuine respect for women. I don’t have children yet, but I wouldn’t have appreciated my father doing that to someone I was “serious” with. It’s unnecessary and makes it seem like I’m somehow weak and in need of that sort of heavy handed threatening.
by: Lila, Mar 20th at 8:28 pm
i would do whatever it takes to protect my child….period! If it takes threats and fear, so be it,There is obviously nothing to fear from our LEGAL system!
by: Pamela, Apr 12th at 1:52 am
I’m a feminist and I can tell you that we HATE the ‘dad on his front porch cleaning his shot gun’ mentality. It’s not intelligent and sends a horrible message. What that viewpoint says is that men need motivation to treat women with respect and without threat of physical harm, they can’t subdue their base desires. I’ve never heard any feminist ever make that argument. We want society to move beyond such ignorant thinking. We want women to be respected and listened to because they’re inherently worthy of dignity just like men are. That kind of thinking devalues both sexes.
by: Debbie, Apr 11th at 6:14 pm
So once again, it’s the girl’s duty to not get raped. By her father’s intervention. Perfect! Let’s STILL teach girls and their families that it is their fault for allowing her to wear low cut tops, allowing her to go out with heavy make up, and by not threatening a minor enough! It is the boys parents job to teach him not to rape a a girl, not her parents.
by: Mandi, Mar 21st at 8:03 pm
Lance, if they’re “serious”, odds are good he cares about her. I’d be glad my daughter is friends with the boy she’s seeing. I doubt he’ll rape her and if they’re going to have consensual sex, better her first experiences be with someone she likes and trusts than not.
by: Elly, Mar 21st at 11:03 pm
Thank you so much for this great blog! I am a girls/women’s rights activist and a girls’ empowerment coach, and I LOVE your message! Your sons are really blessed to have you for a mom! A mother who raises her sons (and her daughters)to be empowered and responsible individuals who treat others with respect – that mother will literally impact generations!
by: Haseena Patel, Mar 18th at 8:57 pm
Yes to everything you said…I have a son and a daughter so Yes, to all of your words.
by: Donna, Mar 18th at 9:01 pm
This. Amen. Thank you.
by: Crista, Mar 18th at 9:07 pm
Thank you so much for writing this. Your words and anger encapsulate my thoughts on the subject so well. As a rape survivor and a domestic violence sexual assault victim’s advocate, I know too well what the girl is going through.
Yes, I’ve been through victim blaming though mine occurred when my home was broken into and I was sleeping. Yes, I went through the agony and humiliation of a rape kit (thank God for my DVSA), yes I went through the fear of testifying and facing my brother who raped me and the fallout within the family for doing so, yes I have flashbacks, PTSD and anxiety despite years of treatment.
by: Paulissa Kipp, Mar 18th at 9:08 pm
Well said. And this will be shared with my grown boys as a reminder.
by: Donna Sizemore, Mar 18th at 9:14 pm
This is EXCELLENT and I’m depressed at how necessary it is. But it is excellent. I have a son and daughter born on the same day, so they have received a lot of my parenting simultaneously & when they’re older all this fucking crap about safety in sexual situations will come up. UGH. I’m sick of lazy ass people not teaching their sons to respect other people’s daughters, and allowing them to learn misogyny is funny and being a predator equals being a man. Shame on media reports blaming the victim even implicitly/subtly. Blame the rapists, and yea, blame their parents and coaches. Sick of it. Thank you for this excellent post.
by: Christine, Mar 18th at 9:21 pm
Thank you for sharing this post. This is too often overlooked and you summed up the issue perfectly.
by: Stephanie, Mar 18th at 9:21 pm
Hella yes.
I have a boy and girl that need to hear the message that you espouse!
by: Joanna, Mar 18th at 9:22 pm
Thank you for writing this.
by: Jeannine, Mar 18th at 9:22 pm
I’m heartbroken that in 2013, people still don’t get it. I have a daughter and a son, and I can’t imagine anyone thinking, not for a split second, that ‘everyone does dumb stuff when they’re young.’ OMG. I can’t even.
by: Marinka, Mar 18th at 9:24 pm
“dumb stuff” that kids do: jump off roofs. maybe experiment with mind altering substances. bike into a lake. rape is not “dumb stuff”. that’s a conscious decision someone has to make!
by: KS, Mar 19th at 3:08 pm
All the examples you gave are conscious decisions too, but I get your point.
You can use the “kids do dumb stuff” argument when they’re damaging themselves. You jump off a roof and break your leg, you feel the pain and learn a lesson.
When the repercussions of the actions are damaging to ANOTHER PERSON, and therefore not felt by the person doing them, the law comes along and teaches you the lesson instead.
by: Anna, Mar 22nd at 7:01 am
Greatest post EVER. I have two sons and I pride myself in the fact that I teach them right along with my daughters that no means no. Period. I am raising my boys to be respectful men. I love this post.
Amen, sister. Amen.
by: Nuala Reilly, Mar 18th at 9:25 pm
You took the words right out of my mouth. I have 3 sons and they already know.
by: L, Mar 18th at 9:27 pm
This. Brilliant, thank you!
by: Liz, Mar 18th at 9:33 pm
I love you so hard for for this, Bestie!!
by: Greis, Mar 18th at 9:39 pm
Exactly. EXACTLY.
by: JudithShakes, Mar 18th at 9:40 pm
Well said! (from a mom of two boys)
by: Maria @amotherworld, Mar 18th at 9:41 pm
I am saving this post and showing my daughter’s this as they grow older. Thank you for writing this post, curse words and all.
by: Mom of 3 Girls, Mar 18th at 9:44 pm
Thank you for this!!!
by: Melissa, Mar 18th at 9:44 pm
Yes yes yes. I’m grateful every day to have a son and this is one reason. I get to help bring a respectful man into this world, to shape him to be a good person, a good husband and a good friend.
My son will know that the only thing that means yes is a very sober “yes.”
by: Katie, Mar 18th at 9:49 pm
Well written. Well said. It’s time to draw a line in the sand. Enough is enough. This bullshit must stop and parents have to step up and lead the charge
by: Brian Smith - PLD (@briansmithpld), Mar 18th at 9:50 pm
Thanks! Well said!
by: Nikki, Mar 18th at 9:54 pm
Mother of two daughters and a rape survivor here. One hundred thousand times THIS. Said exactly right. Thank you.
by: Laura Kaye, Mar 18th at 9:55 pm
God Bless you, and I’m so glad you said SURVIVOR and not victim! You’re stunning and brave!
by: Candy, Mar 19th at 1:06 am
You said it. I’ve got sons, too, and I did not shield them from the hardship I’ve gone through as a victim of child rape. Actively teaching boys to be decent men is a HUGE part of this battle.
by: Pamela Clare, Mar 18th at 9:57 pm
Perfect. I volunteer with women who are affected by this every damn day, and something must be done early on to ensure this rape epidemic ends. SHARED EVERYWHERE!
by: Meegan, Mar 18th at 10:07 pm
We need to teach both. We need to teach boys and girls that rape is wrong. We need to prepare them so when they are out there, they will take caution. Does it suck that you can’t leave your drink unattended because you have to pee? Is it terrible that we need to be on guard when we’re out? Yes, but this, sadly, is the world we live in. It only takes one person to hurt another and until that stops, we must teach our children things that may help them from being traumatized. It is always the rapist’s fault and yes we need to instill in our children that rape is wrong no matter the circumstances but I still would arm my child (son and daughter alike) with knowledge I know has saved others from very bad people ou to do unspeakable things.
by: Will Van Stone Jr, Mar 18th at 10:08 pm
I was raped and Molested several times by a man I barely knew and an ex-boyfriend, I praise this article … VERY well written
by: Rachel, Mar 18th at 10:09 pm
My son will never disrespect a woman in ANY way–emotionally or physically. Why? Because he has been taught how to treat women by his dad and me. And our daughter will (hopefully) never fall victim to a male who doesn’t know how to treat a woman, because she is being brought up to value herself without needing the validity of the opposite sex. It’s devastating to live in a world where these lessons are still needing to be taught, and I thank you for having the voice and the strength to rail against the current sad state of affairs. Well done.
by: Xtina56, Mar 18th at 10:09 pm
While I agree with your overall message, I am a little irked by the “because she is being brought up to value herself without needing the validity of the opposite sex” part. I 100% agree with that message, it seems a little misplaced in reference to a blog about not blaming the victim. As a rape victim, it almost sounds like you are saying that I wouldn’t have been raped if I had not wanted attention from men. That completely doesn’t apply to my situation. But even if it did, and I was that drunk flirty girl at the party, I still wouldn’t deserve to be raped or judged from being raped. That’s the point. A woman should be able to stand naked in a room and be safe from rape.
by: Adelaide, Mar 20th at 9:03 am
Well said, people saying that “good girls with good morals” don’t get raped are the reason that so many women are afraid to come forward. They think they shamed their family and did something wrong.
by: Shell, Mar 22nd at 11:26 pm
Please also teach your son to value himself without needing the validity of the opposite sex. Men need to hear that, too. And please teach your daughter to never disrespect a man in ANY way – emotionally or physically. Women need to hear that, too. You’ve already handled the reverse, so I’ll leave that out. But really, I do think this world would be a better place if people were self-validated and respectful to others.
by: A man, Mar 24th at 8:51 am
Amen and hallelujah, my son will learn the same.
by: Angela, Mar 18th at 10:09 pm
Mothers are certainly the beginning, but the society needs to uphold those standards, too and this idea goes so deep into the culture. As an expat living abroad, my company subscribes us to a security service which sends us alerts about crime, protests, war etc. in the areas where the company has expats. It’s a very expensive service, put together by a long-running, reputable company. Every month or so, I receive an email from them telling me that at least one, if not two or three expats have been raped somewhere in Thailand and this is how they deal with it “These attacks highlight the need for foreign women to take common sense precautions – do not walk alone, especially at night etc. … Nevertheless, crime against foreigners remains petty, and opportunistic.”
I’m sorry, but rape is NEVER petty, NOR opportunistic. Calling rape a crime of opportunity suggests that every man’s default state is ‘rapist’ – perhaps if we can get men to be offended by THAT, then we’ll get somewhere.
by: Danielle, Mar 18th at 10:32 pm
Thats an interesting perspective-if rape is considered opportunistic by our society are men offended by that-our society’s perspective about rape has a flip side that means most men’s default state is ‘rapist’?
by: Tonya, Mar 23rd at 5:27 am
Men SHOULD be offended by this. We all should. Perhaps they can start exerting peer pressure in the direction of respect…
The idea that everyone wants sex, anytime, anywhere, with no consequence, which seems to be the message of media and mainstream feminism, and that we are “nothing but mammals” has reduced everyone to walking talking sex-toys.
by: jp, Apr 11th at 2:48 pm
Most mammals, most animals behave much better than humans too often do.
The qualities which render us outstanding and smart also enable us to be especially vile and evil.
by: Phil Human, Apr 12th at 3:02 pm
I’m offended. That’s not like me at all. I won’t even associate with guys that think it’s OK to try and pick up overly drunk women at bars or even speak of women in derogatory terms. Not all of us are like that. Sadly far too many are.
by: Michael, Apr 13th at 1:00 pm
BRAVO!! Everything I was thinking, thanks!
by: Jen, Mar 18th at 10:37 pm
I have 5 sons and 5 daughters, so I have to teach both sides of this issue quite a few times. Ugh, it disgusts me how that trial panned out. Defending those boys, it just amazes me that society turns things around like that. It’s just so wrong. All boys involved, even the onlookers, are all in the wrong. Makes my stomach turn to think about it.
by: Katrina, Mar 18th at 10:45 pm
I have daughters, two of them. I worry about them all the time. We need to be raising more men in this country to respect other people–not just women but anyone who’s vulnerable. This means that little kid or the one with the funny walk or the strange hat. It’s not all right EVER to do unto someone what you would not want to be done unto you. And moreover, and just as importantly, it’s WRONG to stand by and let someone else do it. At least call the police, or your parents or your teacher or coach or someone you trust. Taking movies is not enough–but it actually helps document the crime. Send the movie to someone who will punish the criminals. Sending it your friends to further humiliate someone is WRONG. Learn to show some respect for fellow human beings–to all living things–to all God’s creatures. You don’t have to love them or even like everyone, you do have to respect them.
by: William Vaughn, Mar 18th at 10:46 pm
Right on, Mr. Vaughn!
by: Debbie, Apr 11th at 6:43 pm
HERE, HERE!
by: Alexandra O'Hurley, Mar 18th at 11:21 pm
Excellent piece. Sharing it with my blog readers and elsewhere. You nailed it, sister.
by: Monica, Mar 18th at 11:22 pm
Well said.
by: Kellie Kamryn, Mar 18th at 11:27 pm
i couldnt have said it better myself. I have a boy and a girl and you bet your ass my son will know to not do crap like that.
by: kelli, Mar 18th at 11:33 pm
YES, this. I am sick of the victims being blamed. THEY are the victims. I have two sons, and yes, I am teaching them that rape is not ok, that no means no.
by: Alison, Mar 18th at 11:39 pm
Yes. Rape is a disgusting and deplorable act. A vast majority of men know this and would never do such a thing to a woman (or another man). Is it really necessary to pull our children aside and tell them the pitfalls and consequences if they were to decide to rape someone?
Rapists know exactly what they are doing when they commit such crimes. Why a small subset of individuals feel the need to do something so horrible to someone else is beyond me, but I do not believe it can be cured by telling my son “Don’t rape, Billy. It’s not nice.”
Instead, how about we raise out children with good morals and a strong ethical code to live their lives by? As parents, that’s our job and all we can do to prepare them for the world they were born into. Teach them right from wrong and reinforce it every day, and there should be no need to get specific.
There will always be terrible people in this world, and parents are only partially to blame. Many things happen to people that cause them to have a skewed view of society and their place in it.
The best we can do is raise our boys with proper etiquette, while at the same time preach to our daughters about how to be safe.
This is how it has been, and will continue to be.
by: Brandon, Mar 18th at 11:45 pm
Of course there is a need to get specific. Shying away from the problem is part of what created it in the first place. If you find it too difficult to talk to your children about then hopefully they will have someone in their lives who will. It’s your old-school, puritanical attitude toward this subject that keeps the problem alive. What we ignore flourishes, and what we face head-on disappears. Teaching our boys proper etiquette? How about teaching them NOT TO RAPE WOMEN. Going out on a limb here, but I feel that the latter may just be a bit more effective.
by: Lacy MacDougall, Mar 19th at 5:19 pm
Teaching all children how to treat human beings would make teaching boys not to rape redundant. If you teach children never to hurt anyone, for any reason, then it would just go without saying that you would never dehumanize a woman by using her as an object. Boys AND girls shouldn’t use PEOPLE as objects for any purpose: ridicule, sexual exploitation, amusement, ANYTHING!! I’m sure these boys didn’t start their dehumanizing at this rape. I’m sure it started out “smaller” with taunting others for the amusement of their friends, etc. These things happen when people stop seeing their victims as human, and start seeing them as “IT.” I agree that there would be no need to get specific if parents did a good enough job teaching their children to respect humans and to behave with compassion and humanity in all situations. I don’t think that view is “keeping the problem alive,” as you put it!
by: Joscelynne, Apr 11th at 2:57 pm
Dumb stuff is backing your car into the mailbox, dumb stuff is having a water balloon fight in the house, dumb stuff is forgetting your homework, dumb stuff is NOT getting drunk, gang raping an unconscious girl, filming it and bragging about it on social media.
by: Brandy, Mar 19th at 12:32 am
but we should teach our daughters that bad things happen if we’re intoxicated to the point of nearly unconsciousness. we become vulnerable to many things…alcohol poisoning, falling down and getting hurt, getting lost, getting robbed or losing personal items, etc…it is a dangerous state to be in…of course nobody should take advantage of that in any way but why put yourself in that situation?
by: gina, Mar 19th at 12:38 am
I agree!
by: Momma of 3, Mar 19th at 10:57 am
Either you’ve forgotten what it was like to be a teen, or don’t have a teen yet. Teenagers will always experiment with stuff in social settings, be it smoking, trying the 1st drink, kissing, whatnot. An inexperienced teen who tries drinking will *not* know what his/her limit is until it’s well beyond.. Kids screw up, it’s part of growing up. What’s wrong with striving for a safe environment for when they screw up?
by: Laurie, Mar 20th at 4:49 pm
Finally a comment I will agree with. The truth is, in 2013 we have come to learn to de-value the human being, to the point were those people who participated by watching, taking video, pictures and the actual assault,believed that moment was occurring for their entertainment. They saw no error, no fault until someone accused them of it. That is what must change, from the teaching environment,the social setting and media and most important the home. I have a son, who would NEVER, EVER, WATCH NOR PARTICIPATE OR PERMIT such a horrendous act. Why, because he was taught to value himself those he loves, and those he has never met.
by: pam, Mar 23rd at 9:48 pm
YES.
by: A man, Mar 24th at 10:04 am
Very true. The world can only benefit from the existence of more gentlemen.
by: Jennifer, Mar 19th at 12:39 am
Your post made me cry. It is so right on. Yes, the girl was drunk but does that make the boys’s treatment of her OK. Hell no! What is wrong with this world that the boys took videos and shared them? Wrong, just wrong in so many ways.
by: Jackie, Mar 19th at 12:50 am
And what’s stunning is, this will actually draw arguments from some people. You wrote this beautifully. LOVE.
by: Candy, Mar 19th at 1:04 am
Why do you think it will draw arguments?
by: A man, Mar 24th at 10:04 am
Because you have proof from the media. CNN reporters giving pity to the perpetrators on “their life is ruined, because of a poor decision.”
Will you see any advocates of rape? No. But you do see blame given the the victim for being drunk, being alone, saying “maybe” instead of “no”, dressing provocatively, etc…
The victims are blamed, ostracized, ignored, and humiliated, because more people are willing pity a boy who doesn’t seem to inherently know that rape is wrong.
by: A better Man, Apr 11th at 1:51 pm
I utterly hat victim blaming, at least as much as rape itself. It is a cold-blooded second rape.
For example Rehtaeh, a Canadian teenager who was raped in 2011. She could have survived the rape itself, but the bullying and victim blaming was too much by far.
It’s impossible that the bulliers didn’t know that she was already wounded and so even more vulnerable than anyone without rape experience, just like burnt or scalded skin can’t stand anything whis ist not cold.
To me, ANYONE involved in this bullying – including the rapists themselves, of course, because of the video they shared – are MURDERERS.
by: Phil Human, Apr 12th at 3:24 pm
Sure we all do “dumb” things when we’re kids – we toilet paper a house, or try and sneak in after curfew (probably getting busted in the process), we try and eat a bagel while riding a bike and wreck (guilty). Those are “dumb” things. Raping, taking advantage of someone, or standing by while something equally heinous takes place is not a “dumb” thing. I thank you for writing this. As I sit next to my infant son, I can only hope that the world is a little bit different by the time he has to face it on his own. I hope that he is armed with the knowledge of what is right and what is wrong, how to make those decisions and what happens when the wrong choice is made. I hope that he is willing to stand up to those who would do the wrong things, and protect those who, for whatever reason, can not protect themselves.
by: NB, Mar 19th at 2:42 am
I agree. Dumb is dumb. We’ve all done it. Rape is a destructive felony. Not like TPing a house. No one should normalize it. Ever.
by: Anne-Marie, Mar 19th at 5:17 am
As a mother of six sons I could NOT have said this better.
by: Tina, Mar 19th at 2:42 am
I totally agree with you and I hope you don’t mind (I didn’t mean to infringe the law) but I translated you article to spanish. It’s in my blog: http://literaturaromanticajuvenil.blogspot.com/2013/03/traduccion-im-so-fucking-sick-of.html
We really need to have more people to think like this.
by: LJR, Mar 19th at 2:49 am
Can’t say much that hasn’t been said already (other than, yes, it is spot on, swearing and all) so I’m sharing for other people to read.
by: Claudia, Mar 19th at 3:02 am
It comes down to teaching respect. I have two sons who respect themselves and in turn have great respect for women. They are not rapists. I never had to tell them not to be I just taught them respect. However, they will often comment on the lack of respect some women have for themselves. Those are the gals that show up drunk at parties, in bars with little or no underwear on underneath very short skirts and put themselves on exhibit. Thankfully my sons are not the least bit attracted to that. We need to teach women to respect themselves more than that as well. This mom has it right but there is a whole lot more to it than talking about how not to get raped. Its about how one represents themselves both male and female. Changing opinions and cultures starts with respect and then a whole lot more of feeling comfortable to speak up in bad situations, no bullying, where cool is not being cool … There is a lot of work to be done.
by: Lee, Mar 19th at 3:41 am
Umm, excuse me Lee, but what century are you from? Partying (i.e. getting drunk and dancing around like an idiot, getting drunk and flirting like an idiot, or just being idiots in large groups +/- booze) is not an expression of a lack of self-respect. Nor is wearing *reasonably* revealing clothing. Rather, these actions are expressions of youth, and drunken partying that of youthful idiocy.
I think you would benefit from watching a performance of the “My Short Skirt” piece from the Vagina Monologues by Eve Ensler. It encapsulates the true reason why many women wear revealing clothing. When I wear short shorts, short skirts, or low-cut tops, its because they make me feel sexy. They make me feel empowered. And I should be able to wear them without your judgement or inferences about my level of self-respect.
by: Dana, Mar 21st at 5:22 am
And is “unreasonably” revealing clothing an expression of a lack of self-respect? I don’t know quite what Lee is referring to, but it sounds like they have raised respectful sons who see the world pretty clearly, and yes, in modern times. If you wear short skirts and feel sexy, that’s great; just know that if you show up to Lee’s house-party super hammered and have a “wardrobe malfunction”, Lee will judge you and probably not invite you over again. But hey, it’s a free world, and we all have the right to be who we are, and think what we want.
by: A man, Mar 24th at 9:15 am
Nope, nope, nope. Women can wear and do what they want without it being a reflection of some self-esteem issue. For your sons to assume so, without knowing /anything about the women in question apart from what they’re wearing/ is patronizing as hell. Moreover, it sets them up in a disturbing position of moral superiority — it’s far too easy from there to tip into “well what did she expect, wearing something like that?”
by: oh jfc, Mar 21st at 1:27 pm
IT IS NEVER A WOMANS FAULT THAT SHE IS RAPED. NEVER EVER!!! It has nothing to do with how she acts, what she wears, how drunk she is. Rape is assault of not only the body but the mind too. Have you heard of the women who have died in India because of gang rape? FFS I just want to throttle women and men that are so ignorant that they can put any kind of blame on women for this. *runs of to punch something* sheesh.
by: Rosemary, Mar 21st at 6:39 pm
How a woman dresses, or how much she chooses to drink is really none of your business or your sons. Inferring that this somehow means a woman doesn’t respect herself is exactly the problem in the first place. By putting that notion into people’s minds, it provides an excuse for rape. It further perpetuates the notion that “she was asking for it”. Just as a man seems free to do what he pleases, drink as much as he wants, dress how he likes, walk where he wants and at whatever time he chooses, a woman should have the same right. Women don’t asked to be raped, and anyone who says otherwise is fooling themselves with some very disgusting, backwards thinking.
by: Al, Mar 21st at 6:45 pm
A-freaking-MEN!!!!
by: Shell, Mar 22nd at 11:36 pm
No, you are really wrong; thinking someone doesn’t respect themselves only leads to rape in your mind, and we really don’t need to have that around in everyone’s head since it’s not a true connection. Who cares if they don’t respect themselves? A good person would care, but only out of empathy, not because they could make an excuse for rape. That’s fucked up. And, straight-up, I judge men who drink too much, blurt out obscenities, and wake me up at 3am by walking by my apartment laughing to be pretty offensive people who probably don’t have their shit together. If I see a guy at a party with an alcohol problem and dirty clothes, I might assume he has less self-respect than others. Is that fucked up? Maybe. I think we could all do well to assume less of each other. But, it’s not as black-and-white as what you seem to be reacting to.
by: A man, Mar 24th at 9:20 am
How do you hit on the estimation that someone must have little respect for him/herself when wearing short clothes?
There might be some people who exhibit their bodies as a kind of ware just for getting some – of the illusion of – affection.
On the other hand, I think most people who exhibit their bodies just proudly show what they have, making propaganda for themselves.
A jeweller exhibiting his show window also doesn’t regard his ware as worthless and be ready to hawk it, and even less he is ready to be robbed.
by: Phil Human, Apr 12th at 3:56 pm
I agree that we need to teach our daughters to respect themselves more – the media and parts of society are constantly shoving ‘sexy’ down young girls throats as the only way to be seen as feminine and many girls who lack self confidence will try and fit in any way they can.
That being said – by ‘we’ need to teach our daughters I mean parents to a point.. but it is also up to society. Just because a girl dresses a little provocatively at a party to get attention does not make her a bad person. [It does not mean she has no self respect either] It may give off the impression of a lack of self respect, but how are respectful sons helping the situation by ‘commenting’ on this lack of self respect? How are fathers helping by being relieved that their sons are ‘not attracted’ to girls ‘like this?’ Perhaps these girls dont have anyone in their lives to teach them self respect, or there are too many people throwing mixed messages at them about what it means to be an attractive woman for them to get straight – so they think they are worthless if not sexy and fun etc. Perhaps on top of being respectful we need to ALSO teach our sons not ‘she needs to learn to have respect for herself so others will respect her,’ but ‘we need to respect her so that she will learn to respect herself.’
Beautifully written post.. the author’s use of colourful language portrays exactly my colourful emotions on the subject – I was shaking with anger reading about the case she referred to. I understand all the comments about pointing fingers at boys, and teaching both sexes, and still teaching girls to defend themselves.. but I really think overall the author just means that we need to teach ALL of our children empathy and respect, sexual and otherwise, towards everyone. The BOYS and GIRLS comments are simply stemming from this particular case – in which the BOYS raped a GIRL – and are a product of the author venting frustrations. GOOD FOR HER!
A tragedy that no one stepped in… it breaks my heart.
by: Christine, Apr 13th at 2:07 am
I have tears in my eyes reading this, thank you.
by: Maryanne, Mar 19th at 3:52 am
wishes more judges were pissed off.
by: Skiplite, Mar 19th at 3:55 am
As a man who has been raped by women (2), this is shortsighted.
by: ABC, Mar 19th at 3:59 am
91% of United States people whose rape accusations resulted in convictions against the accused were female and 9% were male. It also stated that 99% of the people convicted of and imprisoned in response to rape accusations were male, with only 1% of those convicted being female. Facts are facts.
by: Lacy MacDougall, Mar 19th at 5:24 pm
Wow, a woman mansplaining to man! The internet is fascinating.
by: A man, Mar 24th at 9:21 am
I’m sorry that happened to you, no one deserves it, male or female.
by: Shell, Mar 22nd at 11:38 pm
I’m sorry for you but this doesn’t REMOVE a iota from this article. Of course, something has to be ADDED: The fate of boys and men who are raped either by women or by men (which might happen much more often, I think).
by: Phil Human, Apr 12th at 4:06 pm
you forgot to direct disgust towards the absentee father that testified in his sons behalf that said he abandon his son when he was a child and never taught him to be a man. I would have started there!
by: David Harden, Mar 19th at 4:45 am
To ABC. I am so very sorry for all that you have suffered at the hands of women. And, what you have suffered does not negate what Laugh Mom has said.
As the mother of two young men, I agree that this is my task and pray that I have been successful in it, in teaching them not to rape, not to stand by while someone is raped, to take action and intercede when ANYONE – man or woman – is abused in their presence.
This story is beyond horrific for all of the families.
by: SCWINK, Mar 19th at 4:49 am
Seems you might want to also ask ABC what could have prevented him from being raped, as I really doubt you want that for your sons, and I know I speak for society when I say we want to prevent it.
by: A man, Mar 24th at 9:23 am
yes.
by: Lou Pardi, Mar 19th at 4:52 am
Yes. I love this article. To add insult to injury, boys are pitied and excused for a lot of things, not just raping women/men. In society as a whole, we excuse young boys for breaking things, forgetting things, not knowing their manners, by coveting them: “Oh, it’s okay” or “Don’t cry, mommy will buy you a new one”. We excuse all kinds of behaviors from boys and we let them get away with a lot of things we admittedly would not let our daughters get away with. “You ought to sit like a lady!” “Learn some manners!” “Chew with your mouth closed.” This stems partially from the way that women must act proper and ladylike in all situations, whereas it’s okay for a boy to act a bit rough or rude sometimes, because he’s just a boy. Therefore, boys grow up thinking it’s okay or not so bad to do some things that are completely unacceptable. After all, they’re just “boys”/”boys will be boys” or “he’ll learn eventually” or “he’s young, he’ll change.” Nope.
by: Dorothy, Mar 19th at 5:36 am
Parents are much too quick to excuse their child’s horrifying behaviour with the old “he’s really a good kid….” What a pile of horseshit! He’s not a good kid, he has allowed himself to be EVIL. You can’t be a good person if you have evil intentions and behave in an evil way.
What’s happened in this situation is that the parents are weak and they raised weak children. Their characters are flawed because they were LAZY and could not DISCIPLINE themselves. They are the type of people who try to take shortcuts to gain power because they recognize they are inherently weak and too ignorant to figure out another way. This is extreme SELFISHNESS and people are right to condemn it. Hopefully the rapists will recognize how dysfunctional and depraved they are and work hard to try to learn how to become a decent human beings. May they come into contact with the people that can help them learn because the parents, some of their friends and some in the media are totally ignorant of the hard work that these young men must go through in order to become decent human beings.
But enough of them. Our prayers, thoughts and focus should be on all of the people in the world who have been abused. They are the ones that we should be thinking of and focusing our attention on. How can we help them recover from the pain?
by: Lynn Hale, Mar 19th at 5:43 am
How about being armed? Or as Elizabeth Warren would call it – a ‘Big firestick’? It comes down to be willing to protect youselves from animals, and personal responsibility.
by: mouell, Mar 19th at 5:44 am
NO! No, no, NO. Teaching women to carry guns is NOT rape prevention.
by: Shelley, Mar 19th at 12:53 pm
Correct, it is not the ONLY means of rape prevention. But, it is one effective one. Statistically, a woman who is armed is much less likely to be raped. Legally, she has the right to defend herself. Morally, I have no sympathy whatsoever for an attempted rapist who is shot, stabbed, sprayed, etc.
by: Josh, Mar 19th at 9:40 pm
So we should start arming children now?
by: rs, Mar 20th at 2:26 pm
I HUGELY disagree with you. All you have to do is ask a domestic violence female victim what happens when she carries a gun for protection – more often than not SHE will be the victim of the gunshot, not the perpetrator. The fact that Americans feel the need to carry guns at all is just sad.
by: Shell, Mar 22nd at 11:41 pm
No. Women who are raped are constantly questioned, their character called into doubt. If they aren’t believed when they report being raped, why would they suddenly be believed if they KILL THEIR ATTEMPTED RAPIST?
Also, let’s not forget that most rapes are perpetrated by someone known to the victim — a family member, a friend, a partner. It’s not easy to kill someone /at all/ (hence the intensive training our soldiers go through), and it would be even harder to kill someone you know.
by: oh jfc, Mar 21st at 1:32 pm
Thank you! This is perfect & incredibly insightful!!!!
by: Mary_M, Mar 19th at 6:17 am
Thank you. I’ve been waiting for someone to say this for a LONG time. It needs to be said and spread all the time , all over until it hit homes. Teach your sons not to rape! It should be a given. I don’t have a son, but I thought people who do have sons, were teaching them this. I guess not. So bad, so bad.
by: Reecie, Mar 19th at 6:17 am
Honestly, your teenage boys are growing up on a diet of extreme hardcore pornography, do you think for a second when boys see women who love being used for sex, they don’t learn from it?
99% of the comments in this thread are vile and hateful towards those two boys who did something when drunk. They’re on the sex offender registry for life for fingerbanging a drunk girl who was loving the attention earlier in the night.
by: Jason Bryan, Mar 19th at 6:18 am
You sir are an idiot and exactly the type of person this author is speaking of.
by: M, Mar 19th at 11:18 am
Click on the name and you’ll see why he thinks the way he does….sickening. I hope he never has a daughter if that’s how he views women.
by: Shell, Mar 22nd at 11:43 pm
‘fingerbanging’? ‘Loving the attention’? Try repeatedly raping both vaginally and anally while she was unconscious. Your attitude is disgusting. Ho dare you minimise what was done to this girl or suggest she or a bunch of porn actresses were responsible? This is why people need to teach their boys that pornography is not the real world.
by: Naomi, Mar 19th at 1:30 pm
What a jackass… to compare porn to the rape of a young girl not able to express any type of consent is disgusting…. apparently you do not have a daughter & if you do… well I have immense pity for her
by: Angela, Mar 19th at 4:34 pm
Jason, if you were the one drunk and unconscious at a party, a group of guys “finger bang” YOU in the ass, molest YOUR penis, tape it, and distribute for the world to see, I guess we should all pity them too because you were having fun and enjoying attention before you reached your limit…
by: Debbie, Apr 11th at 7:07 pm
We are talking about boys or young men raping an unconciuos girl. It should be perfectly clear that an unconscious person doesn’t love ANYTHING someone might do with him/her, neither during the act nor afterwards. He/she will feel used like a peace of meat when he/she gets aware what happened – especially when the rapists made a video and share it to some social network like in Rehtaeh’s case.
People doing so DESERVE to be branded as sexual offenders forever.
Vile? Rape is vile. Rape victim bullying is vile. Hateful? Calling a rape victim a slut is hateful.
I proudly profess my hate on vile rapists and especially on rape victim bulliers, whom I regard as murderers of worst kind. Hell really must exist, because where should such behaviour come from else.
by: Phil Human, Apr 12th at 4:40 pm
While I agree with the sentiment here… there’s not really much being said… teach our sons to respect women? Well ya, any son from parents who give a shit about how they are raising their is probably getting that.. and the majority of the rest of the boys are gleaning that from our laws, culture and their own sense of empathy. But this is the real world and dirtbag scumhole excuse for humans will always exist, and do fucked up stuff like rape, and worse. So teach the girls! Teach them this reality… teach them how to get loud and kick ass, and that it’s okay to do so at the slightest hint of victimization directed at them. Not because “the responsibility is on them” not to get raped, but because it’s a real and present danger, and they are not powerless against a man’s will… and if rape is his will, he deserves no mercy from her, and the whole rest of society has her back, despite the way the media might sort of sometimes make it seem otherwise. I haven’t followed any of the news on this, but if they are talking about all the otherwise “good things” these pukestain rapist fucks had going for them, maybe it’s to show that even “good kids” can throw it all away with just one act of this nature… idk.. publicly televised castration is probably out of the question.
by: reality check, Mar 19th at 6:28 am
Thank you reality.
by: A man, Mar 24th at 9:26 am
I love this article, but our daughters should be taught the same thing. Women can rape men. I know someone who had it happen to him. So really we should be teaching both our sons and daughters about how not to get raped, and to not rape others. It goes both ways in my opinion.
by: Jennie, Mar 19th at 6:55 am
Yes Jennie absolutely true and I don’t believe it for a second in this case. But I do believe very situation is different and needs to be investigated thoroughly. girls do lie about rape. WE also need to each our daughters they can’t do such things out of spite, regret etc. It does happen. We need to educate all our kids of this. WE can’t just blame or say teach just the boys. It does have to work both ways.
by: Rene Glosny, Mar 20th at 4:02 pm
This is so amazing. I can only hope the rest of us raise girls in a world where parents like you raise boys.
by: T, Mar 19th at 7:30 am
“Dumb stuff when your young” is staying out past curfew, skipping school or lying about where you are going. Rape is malicious and evil at any age. I hope more of the stubenville twitter morons are punished – maybe it will sink in.
by: Zoe, Mar 19th at 8:54 am
My son is going to learn respect. And my daughter is going to learn kick-boxing.
by: CS, Mar 19th at 9:35 am
Your son might like kick-boxing, too.
by: A man, Mar 24th at 9:27 am
I was just telling one of my adult sons I felt the same way you do. We are responsible for teaching our sons about the downfall of being rapist and to convince them it is beneath their dignity to rape anyone.
Then we must hone their social skills so they can successfully intermingle with the opposite sex without ending up on America’s Most Wanted as well.
To do one and not other I doubt works very well? Except for the seriously conceited ones often rape occurs because boys are not taught how to make good judgments about sex and what they expect from their partners.
So many people out there too who are getting into S&M which is troublesome. Too many women are still struggling with their lack of identity out there and allowing themselves to so used and abused to please their partners even at the expense of their own health and safety. I wish it wasn’t this way.
What is it in some people’s nature to give value to such bad treatment to someone who is there for you and is suppose to be someone you love? I feel it just sets these women up for even more extreme acts of violence. Some even dying from the experience.
I know the culture that breeds teenagers who don’t give a damn about anyone but themselves. Often they are told a God will protect this person or that. When that fails to work I must listen to all of the reasons why it didn’t work. In the end it didn’t work because you personally did nothing to stop it from getting worse. To not to help makes you a miserable human being.
Take good care of yourself and your family. I hope your children bring you as much happiness as my children have brought back to me many times over again.
by: Ocenbrz, Mar 19th at 9:42 am
Don’t confuse SM activity with the current topic -it is a consensual activity between legal adults that is enjoyed in a safe mutual context. it’s no more a matter of issue than other forms of erotica. I am a black belt holder and nobody’s fool and a sub identified person since youth. I don’t disrespect anyone and am tired of the prejudice and disrespect people like me receive. Please focus on the real differences, and the real sources of criminal behavior in this culture.
by: D, Mar 23rd at 9:10 am
They are trying to make the same distinction as you; simply saying that we as a society don’t have our shit together for “S&M” (in quotes because I am alluding to the Shades of Grey bullshit) to be popular.
by: A manhttp://www.laughmom.com/2013/03/i-am-so-fucking-sick-of-teaching-our-daughters-not-to-get-raped/?replytocom=1051#respond, Mar 24th at 9:29 am
One thing taught to me by my father was that we are taught right from wrong and the most important thing is not to be pressured by others “because it’s cool or you are breaking some stupid guy code” when you know what is being done is wrong. He said they will have to live with the consequences of their bad actions, but you don’t if you do what’s right and remember that I will always support you when you do the right thing. Those guys who do bad things are not your friends and they are not going to stand by you in a time of crisis. He said a real man will always stand up for what is right. It seems like none of these guys learned that lesson.
by: Rod, Mar 19th at 11:05 am
Couldn’t have said it better!
by: robynjerseygirl, Mar 19th at 11:07 am
Shared… Thank you for writing this. I have a son and a daughter….
by: Courtney, Mar 19th at 11:30 am
Love the passion and the obvious disdain for rapists. However, the attack on boys/men in general is a bit over the top. I have three boys and they are taught the difference between right and wrong and consequences. Again, the disgust for these boys is understandable and they will suffer long term consequences…no pity here. Let’s not go sideways on all boys/men just because of what in reality is just a few.
by: Bill, Mar 19th at 11:43 am
Many different factors here and any one of them can make a difference. Yes, both boys and girls need to be taught but not necessarily about one particular thing, but all things. The simple difference between right and wrong. I will readily admit to being older, in some peoples minds, “over the hill”, “not capable of being logical” or the ever popular, “it’s different now, you don’t understand”. I can easily remember my parents instilling in me the difference between right and wrong but also that a responsible person will stop or interfere when something wrong is being done. They also taught me the value of friends, and the simple fact that no body tried to stop what was happening, in fact they wanted pictures to show off to others tells me that this girl was not among friends. It goes back to the basics, a friend would have not allowed her to get so drunk that she lost control, and if it did happen, would never leave her without getting some responsible help. If the boys at the scene had any common sense or respect for anything, they would have stepped in and protected the girl.
The real cause of all this is not that neither the boys or the girl were not taught about rape or preventing rape, it is the simple fact that they were never taught about right and wrong. It seems that all too often the “code” of today is, “If you want it, take it”.
by: Pat, Mar 19th at 11:59 am
Thank you from the bottom of my heart. I have two daughters and I have taught them everything you and I were taught by our parents as young women. You are right. We should not have to do this.
by: Marge, Mar 19th at 12:01 pm
I agree with Jennie. There were a lot of abusive texts sent from WOMEN to the bloggers who broke the story, saying outright that the victim was drunk, available and deserved it? (actually they said worse than that) This is a sh*tty attitude shared by young women and men alike.
by: Malc, Mar 19th at 12:21 pm
Dead on! I almost threw up watching the media coverage on MANY Major news channels. Not one said they felt bad for the VICTIM! LET’S ALL TEACH OUR BOYS TO BE SELF RESPECTING MEN!
by: Lorrie Eubanks, Mar 19th at 12:24 pm
Rape is already illegal. Telling people not to commit a crime that they know is already illegal won’t hurt anything but I’m not sure how much it will help.
Rapists are a pretty vile bunch of folks, they have already dispensed with any preoccupation about what others think of them.
The thing that stops a rapist or any other violent criminal is the suspicion that their victim may be able to defend themselves.
The real world is not what we wished it was and the truth of the matter is there will always be elements in society that prey on the weak be it physically or mentally.
Fortunately there is a simple and inexpensive way to protect yourself – get a gun and support shall issue laws for concealed carry permits.
Prison interviews with convicted rapists, murderers and other violent criminals confirm that the mere suspicion that a girl (other other potential victim) might be armed is generally sufficient to deter an attack. Nothing is fool proof but it’s a lot more difficult to eat a porcupine than a mouse.
The rest of the politically correct suggestions about wearing different clothes, etc. is fine but there’s nothing like having a gun when you need one. Not having a gun when you need one is a one time mistake.
by: Walter Brown, Mar 19th at 12:52 pm
This woman had a gun and used it to fire warning shots to scare off her rapist and now she’s serving 20 years for attempted murder. Clearly guns are not the answer.
http://www.cnn.com/2012/05/11/justice/florida-stand-ground-sentencing
by: Jack, Mar 19th at 5:03 pm
Guns may not be the answer but this is iniquitous.
by: Phil Human, Apr 12th at 4:53 pm
So, you’re saying that the solution to this problem is to arm 16-year-old girls? Really? That’s hardly sensible. And besides, she was unconscious, she could not have fought back; a gun would have added another element to the equation for sure, but not a good one.
by: lucy, Mar 21st at 6:28 pm
Absolutely spot on. ‘Loving the attention’ of young men, as Mr Bryan says above, does not mean ‘okay to rape’.
by: Dr M Thebo, Mar 19th at 12:55 pm
Awesomeness!!
by: Eoin, Mar 19th at 2:44 pm
Offensive cussing aside (let’s teach all children to not do that) this was an excellent article on placing responsibility where it should be. We should not be a defensive society, let’s be proactive on preventing all the abuse. While all kids mess up and we need to help them learn from their mistakes. But when you mess up and it effects others- there is always a more serious and in this case legal consequence. They did this crime and they need to serve their time. ALL of them.
by: Deborah Montagna, Mar 19th at 2:55 pm
Namaste! I have a son and a daughter and I agree with every fuckin word you said!!! I hope my daughter also meets a world full of boys like yours.
by: Kristen, Mar 19th at 2:56 pm
Namaste! I have a son and a daughter and I agree with every fucking word you said! I too hope my daughter meets a world full of boys like your’s.
by: Kristen, Mar 19th at 2:57 pm
Whats worse is that most men say that they are offended because we cant trust them, and we are bitches because we dont want to talk to them. Stop giving us reasons to fear for our safety and stop minimizing what these boys did. Dont ask us to trust you but in the same breath tell us not get drunk and blame us for being attacked.
by: dasiy, Mar 19th at 3:01 pm
I think they also need to learn how to read body language. Sometimes, a person isn’t comfortable verbalizing their feelings, but their non-verbals are screaming. If it even “looks” like the person may have reservations then you should stop and make sure this is what they want. If they have trouble answering you even then, you should stop because as stated above “I don’t know” is a No.
by: Johnny, Mar 19th at 4:25 pm
Your post sums up my thoughts exactly. Aside from the despicable act and two rapists who obviously still don’t get it based on their “apologies,” the media coverage has been abominable.
by: Glamamom, Mar 19th at 4:29 pm
sing it, sister.
by: Danielle, Mar 19th at 4:34 pm
This was so powerfully written! Well said and much needed!
I watched the news coverage speaking about how these “boys” had made a “dumb mistake” that will now haunt them the rest of their lives. They mentioned how their frontal cortex was not yet fully developed so they could not think about the long-term consequences of their actions…all of it very scientific and probably very true.
However, it is also very IRRELEVANT. To my mind, considering the long-term consequence of raping someone (i.e. jail time and/or being put on the sex offender registry) should not be the reason you choose not to engage in such behavior. It should be because of simple human compassion and EMPATHY for the victim.
It should because they choose NOT to brutalize an unconscious girl… and then terrorize her later with pictures and videos put on facebook for the world to see…because it is EVIL. You don’t need a fully developed frontal cortex to refrain from doing evil things to another person.
Two years is a slap on the wrist, and I am shamed to the ground that people feel sorry for the assailants (“boys will be boys!) rather than empathy for the victims and the countless other girls that have to constantly be on their guard lest this happen to them.
by: Caitlin, Mar 19th at 4:48 pm
I agree to most of what you have written, rape is always the rapists fault no argument from me there.
But the vast majority of people men and women are repulsed by rape. Rape is not purely against women and the stigma is far worse if a man gets raped because ‘why wasn’t he man enough to protect himself’ This is not a gender war. Speak to every man on the street on his opinion on rapist, you’ll find even in prison there is only one form of life lower than the rapist and that’s the child molesters (though in all truth they are just a subset of rapists). So even with the so called worst of all humanity the criminals against rape it seems absurd to say men nead teaching not to rape. That strongly implies men go round raping everything unless taught its not good, implying all men are naturally evil until taught otherwise and that I find very offensive.
My parents never sat me down and told me all about rape and how it was wrong, I knew instinctively that it was, as does every decent human being.
Much like all of life people need to know methods of protecting them selves from the minority of evil people. Like you lock the front door when leaving the house you teach your children how to defend themselves to the best of your and there ability but that is not to say should the fail to defend themselves it is in any way shape or form there fault!
by: Dave, Mar 19th at 4:58 pm
People make mistakes and do dumb things….but rape is not just a dumb oops.
You are right. The emphasis should not be on women and girls to protect themselves from men all the time. Now and men need to step up and take responsibility.
by: Darcy, Mar 19th at 6:37 pm
This could not have been said any better. As a mom I’m sick to death of the responsiblity being on the girl. Where were the parents of these boys? Why did they think treating a girl like a piece of garbage is funny and acceptable. It’s about time parents teach their sons that if they rape a girl, they go to jail, end of discussion.
by: Cara, Mar 19th at 8:26 pm
Thank you for posting this. I was abused by my brother for years and I kept getting told to stay away from him. You’re a good mother.
by: Bee, Mar 19th at 8:27 pm
Actually, false rape accusations are fairly rare and, uh, I’m pretty sure this Steubenville case was pretty damn well investigated seeing has to how it took so long AND THERE WAS PHOTOGRAPHIC AND VIDEO EVIDENCE! Each rape case that is brought to court is thoroughly investigated and, in the case of adults, tried by a jury. So, yeah, your claim about girls “crying rape” is fucking disgusting
by: Emma, Mar 19th at 8:33 pm
Blogged!
http://td365.wordpress.com/2013/03/19/be-careful-dont-get-raped/
by: Tobi-Dawne, Mar 19th at 8:35 pm
I think that those kids were not raised right by their community, their football coach, or their parents. This is a tragic story but I believe that people make mistakes. This is just a huge mistake. With adults around trying to cover up the situation and joking about it and not teaching them the right things, I find it tragic that people are so upset at these boys rather than dealing with the big issue which seemed to be the incredible amount of enabling by not only adult men, but adult women as well. Hearing everyone attack these boys only is just depressing. I think all the people who are only worried about the boys, need to really take a good look at this situation, and the town which has a history of rapes, and start thinking that maybe the problem is bigger than two drunk teenagers making a mistake.
by: Ashamed of our country, Mar 19th at 8:40 pm
WHAT?!?!?! THIS IS EVIL!! The boys didn’t “make a mistake!!!” A mistake is not doing evil. A mistake is doing stupidity. DEHUMANIZING a person is EVIL, and, while they were more than likely enable their whole lives, those people did something EVIL to that girl and need to face the consequences of their actions! How dare you excuse these actions as an “oopsie daisy?!?!” Your MORALS don’t change when you’re drunk. Your inhibitions disappear. Would it be okay to get drunk and shoot up a place? NO! Then it’s NOT okay to get drunk and rape a girl!! It’s not a “misktake.” it’s a horrible, horrible crime against another human being!
by: Joscelynne, Apr 12th at 2:05 am
No. I’m sick of listening to people like you. A man is not a rapist. There are reports out there of the exact opposite happening, a woman raping a younger man, someone who she can drug or overpower. It’s equally on both genders to understand what is and is not right. Don’t you dare try to blame men for the actions of a few boys.
What happened was a travesty, but you’re creating the wrong message from the incident.
by: George, Mar 19th at 8:47 pm
This article does not turn against men, accusing them to be natural born rapists, but it turns against any kind of rape victim blaming.
by: Phil Human, Apr 15th at 5:04 pm
My only problem with your entire article? “…for a girl who didn’t have a say in the matter.” EXCUSE ME? What those boys did was unforgiveable, but that girl drank HERSELF into oblivion. Yes, it’s sad that doing so put her in danger, but it DID put her in danger.
by: Figgs, Mar 19th at 8:52 pm
And the proper and appropriate response to seeing someone drunk and passed out is to rape her. Obviously.
Or, um, not. I bet a lot of boys got blackout drunk at that party, too. How many of them were carried around from party to party and assaulted?
by: oh jfc, Mar 21st at 1:39 pm
Indeed, as the proper way to have a discussion is to assume others mean horribly offensive things. You, sir, are a conversationalist of the highest caliber. Please do justify teenagers drinking to the point of blacking out, one more time, would you?
by: A man, Mar 24th at 9:34 am
This circumstand doesn’t reduce the evilness of raping her, let alone the evilness of making videos of this and posting it in social media.
The former is beastly in the best case, the latter is even more despicable because this behaviour is cold-blooded and deliberate.
If the girl really did drink herself into oblivion – and was not entoxicated by her later rapists – her only “fault” was to trust on the humanity of the male party guests.
by: Phil Human, Apr 15th at 11:59 am
While reading this I found myself wanting to jump up and down and shout Yes! Yes! Yes!
I was raped as a teen by two men who pointed a gun at me as they took turns with their power play. I will never forget that feeling of helplessness and powerlessness.
I’m grateful for good therapists who have helped me to heal these awful wounds.
This post is soooo powerful and I thank you for writing it.
by: Brenda Marroy, Mar 19th at 9:25 pm
“There seems to be some sort of fucked up public opinion that we should pity these boys because, hey, we all do dumb stuff when we’re young. Because it could have been our sons.”
That is because we are taught to identify with men, who are people, and not with women, who are women. Men are presented as the default human; their concerns, their interests, their lives, are the things people are interested in. Women’s stuff is just for women. The Bechdel test (http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/punctuated-equilibrium/2010/nov/24/2) brilliantly illustrates this. We have men at the centre of our lives and women are bit players. So of course, when men do bad things to women, our instant empathy and identification, is with men. That’s why there’s so much empathy for the rapists and so little for their victims.
by: herbsandhags, Mar 19th at 9:26 pm
Why is it that I, as a man, should “take responsibility” for the actions of some twisted hicks?
Isn’t that a little like saying that black people should take responsibility for crime?
Seriously. Listen to yourselves. What part of male childhood includes rape training? Do you think we go out and just wait for the day we can stick it to some woman who isn’t willing? My dad never showed me how to rape anyone.
As far as the author being “sick of teaching her daughters” (who are actually boys…? Wtf?) to avoid being raped. Tough. Sorry- but our society generally condones violence and murder from an early age. There are still murders and fights. Where is the campaign to stop these crimes? There is none.
Bad people will still do shit theyre not supposed to do. Sad, yes- but a fact of life. I am positive that any amount of effort put into “teaching boys not to rape” will be a failure- as the ones who DO commit the crime have never will never listen in the first place.
Thank you.
Uli (Who is NOT a rapist by default even though he is a man)
by: Uli, Mar 20th at 9:05 am
“What part of male childhood includes rape training?”
Rape training is absolutely part of a female childhood. A pretty big part, on fact. It should be part of male childhood as well.
by: M, Mar 20th at 7:11 pm
*in fact
by: M, Mar 20th at 7:12 pm
As i mentioned before, we all (assuming that you came from a decent school) were taught that violence against others was deplorable- REGARDLESS of gender.
Isn’t that acceptable enough? Do we really have to say to all boys “hey, you are a boy, so you will probably grow up to be a rapist if I dont tell you NOT TO RAPE.”
These rapists who have heard the first message and disregarded it- they would listen to the other message that says DONT RAPE instead? Why?
I am amazed that more dont find this inherently sexist. Similar to my example above- if we went around saying to minorities “hey, black folk- stop the crime. It’s YOUR responsibility” minorities would be offended and rightfully so.
by: Uli, Mar 21st at 1:29 pm
I’m having a hard time tracking down the study I want (all I can find is the Lisak and Miller at a quick glance, which showed that some men were willing to commit [and admit to] acts that would be defined as rape, so long as the word “rape” wasn’t used in the questionnaire given, but there was a study done of school aged children about sex and consent. The study found that a considerable majority of children did not understand what was rape. They believed that getting someone drunk in order to have sex with them (even if that person wouldn’t have sex with them when sober) was ok, that if people were dating, or married, that it wasn’t rape if one partner forced sex on the other.
I can’t find the exact questions quickly, but I think that point is pretty key — you’re reducing it to the absurd to say “you’ll grow up to be a rapist if I don’t tell you NOT TO RAPE.” But a discussion of enthusiastic consent, of “yes means yes” and /any other answer/ from “Um…maybe” to “No” means NO. That alcohol is not an acceptable subsitute for consent. Those are the things that we can teach.
The reason the article author is addressing this to men/boys is that girls are already taught over and over how not to be raped, and then they’re still blamed if they are. That’s what’s sexist. This is trying to restore balance to the conversation.
by: oh jfc, Mar 21st at 1:59 pm
I’m missing a bracket after “given” above, and a semicolon instead of a comma after “ok” — typing too quickly in a small box.
by: oh jfc, Mar 21st at 2:00 pm
I’m sorry but your logic here is off. How is it NOT sexist to only teach girls how to avoid rape without teaching boys not to perpetrate. Its not the victim’s responsibility to not allow a rape to occur. And no, it’s not about schools teaching us to not be violent. Obviously it’s NOT enough or rape wouldn’t be such a monumental problem. It’s about parents teaching their children to respect others. .
by: M, Mar 23rd at 12:41 am
Its sexist because you’re targeting boys assuming that otherwise they would commit the crime. It is NOT sexist to teach women to avoid being raped because they are committing no crime- weather being raped or not.
(and when caught, rapists are still held accountable for the crime, in most countries.)
As I said, and everyone seems to be missing- try to organize a program to teach minorities not to commit crime. Given that something like 58% of the American prison population is Black/Hispanic, it should be a good effort, no?
The logic here is the same. You can NOT single out a demographic segment of the population and give them “education” about some behavior you believe they will be predisposed to based on the colour of their skin or their naughty bits.
I believe that American society should have a MUCH better education system so that EVERYONE is taught to respect one another. We can do this without targeting one demographic of the population and singling them out.
Running around shouting “Teach men to stop rape.” Is a great way of offending men, including me- and alienating them from your cause (which could be better served in another capacity that benefits both WOMEN and MEN).
by: Uli, Mar 23rd at 1:53 am
It would be non-sexist to teach children how to manage their sexual agency and individuality in a burgeoning world of crazy things and interesting people. A big part of that message would probably be how to protect yourself, and how to protect others from your own possible ignorance. Guys and girls, gay and straight.
by: A man, Mar 24th at 9:37 am
The article is not claiming that boys or men were natural born rapists.
It just says that rape is the perpetrator’s, not the victim’s fault.
by: Phil Human, Apr 15th at 1:39 pm
I think you deeeply misunderstood the article. It doesn’t say you were responsable or “should take responsability” for other men who rape.
This article is not just about rape but even more about victim blame which is unfortunately still very common.
It says nothing but IF you raped a girl it were no one’s but your fault, especially not the girl’s, however improvident – I also could say overtrustful – she had behaved.
by: Phil Human, Apr 15th at 12:55 pm
I am the father of 3 grown sons. They grew up knowing that I would stand by them for life, even if they were convicted of murder… but if they were convicted of rape they were on their own. It’s not hard to teach people about right and wrong, if YOU know what they are.
by: Richard D. Rolen, Mar 20th at 12:53 pm
Absolutely.
Rape is absolutely an unforgivable sin.
I have three sons. The oldest has had the same lecture. There is no excuse for rape, and no forgiveness.
by: ShredderFeeder, Mar 20th at 2:00 pm
So, deprive a human of life – Dad’s cool with that, deprive someone of agency – nah, Son!. WTF?
by: A man, Mar 24th at 9:40 am
Not that Im on board with [forgiving] murder… but murder can be an act of passion that takes only seconds. It takes a conscience decision, in some cases a struggle, and a lot more time to commit a rape. And I am sure that rape deprive’s a person of much more than just their ‘agency’…for the rest of their life.
by: Christine, Apr 13th at 1:03 am
“My 16 year old was blind drunk” should not be considered a defense, but an additional charge.
by: Jonathan, Mar 20th at 1:27 pm
Where’s the “Like” button for this comment.
by: ShredderFeeder, Mar 20th at 1:53 pm
You are spot on Laughing Mom, and don’t let the ignorance get you down. We have to keep fighting to educate the masses, and you’re on the front lines. Thank you for your thoughts!
by: Marc Baldwin, Mar 20th at 1:37 pm
Amazing, right on, I have two girls, and a boy, and I agree with everything written above….
by: Maren, Mar 20th at 5:14 pm
I totally agree with you, sister! What you say is just common sense. I cannot believe how many butt-hurt men are commenting on this blog. Why is it offensive to ask that parents teach their boys responsibility? Why is it offensive to ask boys to treat girls and women as people, not objects? The author never says that we shouldn’t teach our daughters caution, but she does say that she’s tired of that being the only action taken by parents. This is not about false accusations (which, in the context of how many rapes are even reported, is incredibly miniscule). This is about a proven assault that shows the attitude of machismo and utter lack or responsibility or respect for humanity shown by the young male members of this particular community. Where do you think they learned such an attitude, hm? The author also does not state anywhere that all men are rapists, so men, you can get your boxers out of a bunch!
by: Red Bird, Mar 20th at 6:07 pm
Spot on. I was taught once the words “No” are uttered, that everything comes to a stop. No teasing or petting, just done. In my 20′s I lost a few dates that way, but extremely happy being raised by a mom to respect women.
by: Brian, Mar 20th at 6:24 pm
thank you!! as the daughter of two girls i’m constantly ever vigilant against men, boys and even women who are out to use, abuse and mis-treat them for their own gain whatever form it looks. i’m grateful that someone has said something that it isn’t fully the woman’s responsibility to take care of herself but the responsibility of parents to teach their children to care for and respect others. thank you.
by: heather spence, Mar 20th at 8:44 pm
This is the most articulate, honest and smart thing anyone has said to date about this tragedy AND about this fucking bullshit coverage of these two “very good students” and “star football players”. You said what no one else is saying: THEY ARE RAPISTS. It’s not the girl’s (or even the girls’) fault. THESE BOYS RAPED. And they thought it was funny. And they thought the YouTube video was funny.
by: Amy, Mar 20th at 9:56 pm
Just to be a bit hyperbolic: I’m actually fucking sick of people getting fucking sick about teaching our daughters these lessons.
That said, I agree that any elements which encourages a culture that ever sanctions rape should be rooted out.
Here’s the thing:
When daughters are taught these lessons, it must be emphasized that these are lessons to PROTECT the person. It’s not a matter of responsibility or culpability on the woman if something does happen. A homeowner is still an innocent victim of a robbery even if they don’t have a home security system, just as a woman is innocent if she is the victim of rape.
Yes, I understand what you’re saying. You’re saying, “Well, if men were taught not to rape women, if they didn’t feel like they had license to use women like this, then this ridiculous vigilance expected of women wouldn’t be necessary!”
But crimes always happen. Muggings occur. Home robberies occur. Murders occur.
And all of us have to take reasonable measures to protect ourselves, not because we are any less innocent if we are victims of crime when we don’t take these measures.
by: DGB, Mar 20th at 11:30 pm
Do you know how many women commit suicide because of rape so your protection arguement is bullshit. Unlike murder rape is a trauma you live with forever.
…
by: Rosemary, Mar 21st at 6:54 pm
…and those women would rather not have protected themselves? I’m sorry, but I really doubt that even you can see your point.
by: A man, Mar 24th at 9:44 am
I have three daughters and of course I will teach them all the bullshit things they have to do to stay safe. Is it so outrageous of me to expect the parents of boys to teach their boys to respect my girls? To teach them that they are human? I don’t think it is.
by: 808Momof3, Mar 21st at 2:57 am
Men have not been accountable in our nation until they are caught and cornered! Starting with Presidents who have lied, cheated, and blamed their actions on whoever is closest, coaches raping young boys and still cry innocent, step-fathers raping step-daughters and denying their actions. Its not just our young sons, its the adult men who continue to rape their own daughters, its the adult men that slip a pill in young women’s drinks, its the Adult Men in the Military raping the women in the Military! Where is that righteous man who stands up for their women? Where did they go? This is what young men see…no wonder they think its funny! Look at their role models!
Thank you for your post, I Love your honesty and passion to stop this mentality. Young men should be taught, its not ok to rape, even if they know adult men who do and have done it.
by: Peggy, Mar 21st at 3:19 am
Thank you!
by: CindyS, Mar 21st at 3:44 am
I think this is a lovely piece of ridiculous sensationalism.
Those kids did wrong, and definitely deserve a lot of things and our pity is not one of them. If people don’t teach their kids not to rape people this would make complete sense, be a great pep talk. But in reality, people teach their kids all kinds of things, not to steal, not to have sex until marriage, not to j-walk, etc. To blame this on parents or society is complete ridiculousness. It takes ownership of the act of raping away from the purpotrators, and places it on other people, which is exactly what the rapists are trying to do to begin with. By blaming the girl, the booze, or whatever else. With articles like this you are helping them.
Rape, despite popular belief, has nothing really to do with how attractive an individual, what they are doing or anything else it is and has more to do with power humiliation, degradation, and opportunity. To teach your kids how they dress will affect whether or not you will get raped is absurd. The only thing it will affect, is the defences ability to make a defence along the lines of a woman was “asking for it” which I believe is something most so called feminists seem to miss. To make a real change, change the legislature, make how a woman dresses not even an option for a defence in court, its something that should be considered an important battle in woman’s rights. Take up the fight, for REAL CONCRETE CHANGE.
But don’t forget, about the dangers of society. “Civilized society”, although often not the case is a dangerous place, you have to be vigilant, if you want to or not. Now ever since I was a kid, my dad always used to tell me, locks only keep the honest people out. What I always took this to mean, was despite your best efforts to keep something safe, if someone is going to take it they will find a way. But that doesn’t mean to not take reasonable precautions. Not walking down a dark ally way alone, is not only smart for a woman, but a man too, it provides opportunity. Opportunity to be robbed, beaten, raped, murdered, and if you think men are immune to these situations you live in a very sheltered world. The reality is men too get raped, men are abused by their spouses, and it is people who write articles like this, claiming this is only a woman’s issue, and it is all men’s fault, are misguided. Even force men who experience these things to feel emasculated.
Rape is a people problem. It is only by working together, and not pointing fingers that we can work to eliminate it.
Make real change, not sensationalistic arguments with no foundation, for those who weren’t fully paying attention when they read this article, the author implies people don’t teach their kids raping people is wrong. As a man, I’ve never been to raping school, I’ve never been told raping is a good thing and everyone should try it, my dad didn’t take me on a vision walk to go have my first rape, rape is not a right of passage like a bar mitzvah, and I think its disgusting that this author implies such.
by: JF, Mar 21st at 4:50 am
I can see how good men hate being tarred with this broad brush. However there IS a male culture of rape that exists whether a particular man subscribes or not. It is up to good men (and brave women) to stop this when it rears its ugly head.
1. The football players that Mays and Richmond associated with apparently nicknamed themselves “The rape squad”. Their colleagues (I’m just guessing these included more males than females) could have tried to nip this in the bud.
2. Other boys saw what happened. They apparently did nothing to stop it.
3. Some activities or associations seem to promote this sort of entitlement and violence. Adults should bear some responsibility. From what I can tell from the media reports, even the coaches just told them to go away rather than trying to stop them from carrying the poor girl around between parties.
4. The girl was apparently given a date rape drug. So the posts up-stream that posit a drunken lack of self respect (even if that were relevant) are off the mark.
I have already had a talk with my 17 yr old son about all this. As soon as it became clear what I was referring to, he beat me to the punchline: “Mom, I would have made them stop.” Perhaps this is idealistic, but I’m guessing as a boy and a peer, he would have had a better chance at succeeding than a girl would have.
by: Susan, Mar 24th at 9:12 pm
@ JF – Sorry JF, I agree that there is personal responsibility involved and personal safety is everyone’s repsonsibility, but as to men not being “taught” to rape you are off the mark. As the Mother of two boys, I have actively taught my sons RESPECT and BOUNDARIES their whole lives. Nothing was ever outta-bounds, and there was a reason for it! I’d sit through teen movies depicting girl-chasing with them. I’d discuss news articles about boys sexually assaulting girls with them – from the age that they were old enough to understand what was happening – and we would discuss why what had happened was wrong. Why the boys in the film were being jerks. Why the boys who had accosted the girl at school were assholes. I ACTIVELY taught them NOT TO TAKE ADVANTAGE! Not that their personalities would have lent them to do that, but I wanted to make it clear to them that if they saw OTHER boys engaging in that kind of behaviour that THEY had a moral obligation to stand up and say NO! To NOT let it happen! To put a stop to it! Any parent who has failed to instil in their own son that this kind of behaviour ISN’T funny, ISN’T just boys-being-boys, IS ACTUALLY RAPE, has failed their sons, and failed society. These parents need to shoulder the burden of the responsibility for never having given that lesson – or more to the point – for having portrayed girls as “asking for it” by comments that they may have made about girls dressing like “tarts”, or being “sluts”, or “easy”. Boys don’t just wake up one morning and think – gee I think I’ll go out and overpower a girl today and fuck her to see if I can! They are taught, whether by the attitude of their parents or friends, that this is a perfectly acceptable thing to do…. It’s time we recognized that!!!!!
by: Mom of Two Boys, Apr 11th at 3:24 pm
very few of these viewpoints could ever stand in a court of law. Reading through my sister’s comments many of these strike me as laughably outrageous. The venom of pure hate for our fellow human beings is monstrous. Not one person is born predestined toward crime. That bit of 1980′s pseudoscience has been proven false. There are differences between men and women, however, lets try to remember we need to rasie bright children who are self confidant and secure in their nature. I didn’t raise my Sons to be afraid of females and I didn’t raise my daughters to be afraid of males. If someone wanted to raise a weak, submissive person all they would have to do is listen to some of the above persons. I would really feel sorry in twenty years to see young person who couldn’t stand up for themselves in any sort of confrontation. Be it a drunk person outside a public establishment or in a board room alone with the other sex. Thankfully, most parents understand the worst thing they can do to a young person is to distoy a young mind with the troubles, superstions and hang-ups of the prior own generation. Stand Up, Hold your head up learn personal defence, Do not discriminate against Anyone based on Race, Sex, religion or for that matter personal small-mindedness. By the way, I was raped, beaten and left for dead on the side of a road at the age of 23. Never spread hate anywhere to anyone.
by: V J S, Mar 21st at 4:53 am
Thank you. Please help me keep this spirit strong in myself, for I seek a future of assertive humanity.
by: A man, Mar 24th at 9:47 am
Most of the above comments would never pass the light of day. They are filled with hate, disgust and small-minded sexual pettiness. If anyone tried to raise a boy or a girl with the venom I’ve read above, the poor child would never stand a chance of developing a working mind of their own. Girl or Boy, raising one to be scared of another based on sex is foolish and unpractical. The child would be a nothing more than a constant victim. I seriously doubt anyone would really follow much of the bias I’ve read above. To be afraid of another child based on such discriminatory foolishness is not realistic. The child would be an emotional wreck and it is picked up by other children as if it were a wireless signal. Instead, Empower those young minds to be self-assured, hold their head up high, have self defense skills of their own. They should know
by: V J S, Mar 21st at 5:03 am
warning signs of a predator, and be able to keep themselves as safe from situations like where they possibly fall into harm. Isn’t that what we all hope for? No one wants to see a child of any age fall into tragic situations, I’m simply saying Don’t make innocent boys or girls into monstors simply because they were born one sex or another. That’s simply hate and we should see it for what it is. Never allow ourselves to become part of it.
by: V J S, Mar 21st at 5:10 am
this video adds to the discussion:
http://www.ted.com/talks/colin_stokes_how_movies_teach_manhood.html
by: Jude Gerrard, Mar 21st at 9:35 am
This is perfectly stated, thanks for stating your opinion which i feel is the opinion of most all parents, or should be. i have always thought it was messed up that we have to teach our girls to NOT get raped, while the boys should also be taught to be respectful and no means no. i wish they would read this on CNN.
by: CDR, Mar 21st at 11:47 am
Brilliant! When you started off with the warning that you were angry, I figured you were sure to botch it somewhere — maybe with visions of vengeance that compromised your message — but you didn’t.
The one thing I’ll add has to do w/ your response to the common apologist remark that “it could have been our sons.” We do indeed need to squash that attitude and commit ourselves to that NOT being our sons, but what I want to add is the confession that looking back… that could have been *ME*. It wasn’t, but I was an idiot as a teenager, and I was definitely guilty of objectifying teenage girls. I cannot look back at who I was at 16 and say for sure that I wouldn’t have made a similar, disgusting choice under the wrong circumstances. That’s shameful to admit, and it’s scary, and it’s humbling. I pray my son never has to look back on his life with similar uncertainty, and I will continue to raise him in a way that helps avoid that.
by: Just a guy, Mar 21st at 12:46 pm
You are right, we need to teach our sons but they will learn much more by how we act than what we say…. FATHERS! Your sons are watching how you treat, talk to and about their mothers and other women. Never forget that!!
by: Lorraine Frenette, Mar 21st at 1:26 pm
A-freaking-men!!!
I have 2 sons and a daughter and my daughter will grow up watching me teach my sons that NO means NO! They WILL respect all human beings, regardless of which gender they identify with.
by: Allie, Mar 21st at 1:47 pm
You are SPOT on correct in this whole BLOG! Oh my God what have we as a society come to? It’s so tragic in soooo many ways!!
by: Carrie Hilliard, Mar 21st at 1:59 pm
Moms and just parents in general don’t seem to realize that they are the ones that raised our generation and are directly responsible for all the problems occurring as a result. You think this happened in the 50′s?? Probably not…
by: Will, Mar 21st at 2:10 pm
Of course it happened in the 50s. It was thought to be the girl’s fault then, and it wasn’t reported.
by: Susan, Mar 24th at 9:15 pm
This article is wrong.
For reasons that should be obvious to any adult, the world will have evil people (e.g., rapists) in it, no matter how hard you wish otherwise. The few responsible people in this world “teaching” your sons will accomplish nothing because: (1) most people don’t need to be taught it’s not okay (or even desirable) to rape somebody because it’s obvious; and (2) the sons of sane and responsible parents are very unlikely to be the problem. It’s other peoples’ sons that will be. You can never eliminate it from the world at large. Given the inevitability of evil, it is, however, practical to teach women to avoid danger and defend themsevles should the unthinkable happen. Your article, while high-minded, is naive and actually hurtful to women. Keep teaching them to be ready to defend themselves. They have to be ready. The world in all its ugliness demands it.
by: Raoul, Mar 21st at 3:03 pm
Actually both are necessary…but only because as you say…some people refuse to, or are unable to, teach their sons not to rape. As long as that is true girls will need to know how to protect themselves.
However if no one ever gets upset and tried to change things…then things will never change. Boys need to be taught!!
by: Elle, Mar 21st at 5:35 pm
Fuck that boys need to be upset, let’s change some things.
by: A man, Mar 24th at 9:50 am
YES! YES! YES. Thank you!!!
by: heidi e.v. (@quita_bunnies), Mar 21st at 5:27 pm
As a male in college, I’m completely surrounded with rape culture. I’ve been to numerous talks and seminars where the instructor told every female in the room to watch out and keep a keen eye so they don’t get raped, and to never leave their drink unattended, etc… If you look for something hard enough, you’ll eventually find it, and with all the needless encouragement to look for rapists and all those evil boys out there, girls know that crying “Rape!” will get them out of any situation their lack of self control finds themselves to be in.
by: College Male, Mar 21st at 5:38 pm
http://www.care2.com/causes/yale-fraternity-pledges-chant-about-rape.html
No, you don’t have to look very far to find a culture of rape on college campuses. Sometimes it marches right down the street singing about it. These are the sons of some of the wealthiest and most influential people in the world, and to them rape is a joke. Clearly their parents didn’t do a very good job of teaching them how to respect women, so we should we expect more from some small town kids in Ohio?
by: lucy, Mar 21st at 6:44 pm
Did you go to seminars about rape prevention?
by: A man, Mar 24th at 9:51 am
I agree 100%, but would add one critical thing – we need to teach our daughters as WELL. Not to not get raped, but about the culture of consent and respect. One of the most gut-churning aspects of the whole Steubenville case for me was how many teenaged, female peers of the accused and the victim sided with the accused and bullied, menaced, and shunned the girl who was raped.
The culture of adolescence is such a terribly fucking cruel arena, where one is never sure who their real friends are, and girls see one another as competition.
We need to teach our CHILDREN, regardless of their gender, to treat one another with compassion and respect, and to do the right thing.
by: Beth, Mar 21st at 5:40 pm
This whole this is terribly confused between ‘responsible’ and ‘prepared’. I completely agree that these men really should not, and I think our society does a great job of teaching us that rape, among other crimes, are just plain wrong.
But to say that women should not prepare themselves, simply because men are at fault is RIDICULOUS. What the fuck are you on? A trained lion shouldn’t hurt its trainer, but that does NOT mean their trainers can be careless and start wearing meat suits and wrestling them. YES, the rapist is in the wrong, but to say that these social rules should not exist is completely stupid. Being prepared saves lives.
by: anonymous, Mar 21st at 6:02 pm
Last time I checked, teenaged boys were not wild animals. Comparing them suggests that all teenaged boys are minutes away from losing control and raping the nearest girl. If that is the case, then perhaps we need to instill curfews for teenaged boys. Perhaps instead of not allowing our daughters to go out at night, or to dress however they want to dress, we should lock our wild animal sons in cages as they are incapable of controlling themselves.
Your argument is ridiculous. Those boys, all men who rape, make a conscious decision to do so. To compare rape to a wild animal feeding suggests that rape is some sort of atavistic act that men can chose not to engage in.
by: lucy, Mar 21st at 6:49 pm
You’ve completely misunderstood what I am saying. Not all teenaged boys rape, not all rapists are teenaged boys. Seriously think about what you read and hear, please. The kind of sick fuck that does this, and other such heinous acts is what I was comparing to an animal, who I stated was acting against training (like these boys acting out against what they were taught/trained).
by: anonymous, Mar 21st at 7:52 pm
Yes, the girl might at some point have been able to take apt precautions for lowering her risk of being raped, but that means nothing for the “distribution of guilt” in the issue of rape: Perpetrator 100%, victim 0%.
A man or a boy is not a lion, and such a deliberate thing like a rape is completely different from an animal accident.
O.K.: If a rapist regards himself as being in the role of the trained lion, he might be sent to the zoo instead of jail but the main issue is that he will live behind bars at least as long as he remains dangerous.
by: Phil Human, Apr 15th at 8:04 pm
This is why I will be teaching my daughter firearms safety and getting her a concealed carry permit ASAP. This is why my husband will participate in raising our sons and daughter in what a man should behave like and why we will remain a 2nd Amendment loving, participating family. No means no, but words won’t stop a horny creep in his tracks. Looking down the barrel of a black steel tube will, one way or another.
by: Katrina, Mar 21st at 6:35 pm
The girl was unconscious, hardly in the position to fire a weapon. Adding a gun to the evening’s activities would have most likely added some sort of manslaughter charge to the mix.
by: lucy, Mar 21st at 6:51 pm
Damn straight.
by: Shelley, Mar 21st at 6:48 pm
challenge accepted
by: anon, Mar 21st at 7:03 pm
Agreed. The time has come to shift thinking away from ‘Don’t get raped’ toward “Don’t Rape”.
One Voice Raised: A Triumph Over Rape (Amazon)
by: Jennifer Wheatley Wolf, Mar 21st at 7:14 pm
I have two sons and well, yes *waves hands* to all of this.
by: Stephanie, Mar 21st at 7:43 pm
And that just because she said ‘yes’ at some other time, doesn’t mean the answer has to be ‘yes’ this time.
by: Clei, Mar 21st at 7:46 pm
I am so glad I finally am reading something like this. You make many valid points. Thank you for sharing.
by: Stephanie Colpo, Mar 21st at 7:49 pm
I don’t know you and I’ve never read you before, but I like you already.
I have a son and we teach him to respect everyone who he encounters. I will be teaching him these things when he gets older, as they were taught to me.
Sadly however, I will also be teaching my daughter all of the things that you were taught growing up. Even though in a perfect world she should be able to wear what she wants, trust someone when they offer her a drink, be able to let her guard down once in a while and not have to worry about predators. We all know the world will never be perfect.
That being said, maybe if more people teach their sons what you have been teaching yours, we can get just a little bit closer.
Great post.
by: Rob, Mar 21st at 8:24 pm
Bravo!
by: Mary Helen, Mar 21st at 8:39 pm
It certainly does not need to be taught to all sons. Such a stereotype. Very wrong. Rape is wrong. But my parents never needed to tell me that. However your sons might need that lesson. It’s all in how you raise them isn’t it?
by: Bob, Mar 21st at 9:35 pm
A-men!!! I have two daughters and a son. Of course I’ll teach all of my kids the things they need to know to protect themselves, not just from rape, but from violence in general, such as being aware of their surroundings and that it’s best to travel in groups if you’re in unfamiliar territory, etc. But I’m a firm believer in that women should be able to wear whatever they want to wear, go wherever they want to go, drink however much they want to drink without the fear of being raped. My children – ALL of them – will be taught what rape is. What sex is (since today’s teens don’t even seem to realize what does and doesn’t constitute sex, therefore can’t really distinguish rape). That date rape is rape. That statutory rape is rape. And, like you said, silence, drunkenness, lack of consciousness, all of it means “NO!” We as a society have got to start teaching our kids, especially our sons, these things or we’re going to continue to see cases like Steubenville or the latest one in Connecticut.
by: Aubrey, Mar 21st at 9:55 pm
I would like to say I totally agree with you but I couldn’t get past your filthy language. Being angry is no excuse to talk so vulgar no more than being drunk makes it ok to rape. What a pitiful example.
by: Sue, Mar 21st at 10:36 pm
I think a great many people have misunderstood the message this person was trying to portray. I’m in full agreement with her. It’s a sad thing that most of the preventative measures being taken in regards to rape is directed at girls. From a young age girls are constantly taught to never trust a male, because you could get raped if you let down your guard. The point she makes with this article is … Why are we only teaching the girls what to do to prevent rape? Why are we not teaching the males in our society that women should be treated with respect and not objects? Don’t forget that media and the Internet are teaming with ads and pornography that does nothing BUT objectify women. One of the preventative measures we as a society should be focusing on is teaching our children that those ads and that pornography doesn’t portray the real world. We need to help counteract that exposure by ensuring we are teaching our boys that women are people too, and that any hesitation means no. No one is saying that if your boy isn’t taught NOT to rape that of course he will. What we’re saying is that in today’s society too many of our children become desensitized to the damage something like this may cause. And people are right, those who wish to do evil will of course do it regardless of what is taught to them, but we have to start somewhere, and teaching our children is a great place to start. Also, assuming our children get the message without speaking plainly is naive. This is something that requires complete openness and honesty, otherwise our kids are learning the specifics elsewhere … Like tv and the Internet.
by: Lynn, Mar 22nd at 12:10 am
I am a proud mother of a son(20) & a daughter (15) they do not drink, smoke, or do drugs(Thank God or Thank Me for bringing them up the best way that I know how to) They do throw out the FUCK word once in awhile! approx. 2 yrs ago my son was at a small neighborhood house party and there was an 18 yo old male who was harassing another male, who was 17, the 18 yo intimidated the 17 yo, to were he had pulled the boys sneaker’s off and was saying to him, this is what it’s like in jail, then ripped his clothes off of him, as my son was walking into the room-the 18 yo got behind the 17 yo making sexual motions(humping) My son stopped this asshole from possibly raping this boy, yes, police were involved, yes, we had people drive by yelling “snitch”…we made it through it, guess where that 18 yo child molester is????? You got it, in jail! I’ve read so many comments my head is spinning! People, don’t get off track about what the real deal is here…stop attacking each other…We all need to teach our children the difference between what’s right & what’s wrong, and if you cant teach them, you should have never had them or get them some professional help.
by: T, Mar 22nd at 1:04 am
You are spot on, why aren’t we teaching this in school. We should start teaching our kids this in kindergarten, this should be taught along with bullying. Parents are also responsible for modelling this at home, when our kids take the family car out we ask them to respect our property but yet do we teach them about how to treat and respect girls. The boys who did terrible CRIME shouldn’t be pity, there trial was fair. And the fact they are going to spend time in jail and not be able to do all the things teens should do is the result of THEIR ACTIONS.Saying that I also believe we as a society need to shoulder some of the blame, why do we hold up our athletes as special people, why to put them on a pedestal. We have created a false sense of importance, that the are above the rest of the kids.
by: albert merrick, Mar 22nd at 1:45 am
come on down and Support Rape Crsis of Carroll County Maryland on April 13th 2013 starting at 10am for walk a mile
by: Deb, Mar 22nd at 2:00 am
Yes, we need to teach our own boys differently, but we also have to go after the rape culture. We need to require the same certification for anyone making entertainment for children and youth that we require for teachers. We need to eliminate pornography from the internet, yes we need make the world safer for women by curbing somebody’s “free speech.” We need to be thinking of strategies for changing the culture, and that means the media and more.
by: Liz, Mar 22nd at 3:14 am
Perfect! Thanks for sharing your thoughts
by: Stacey, Mar 22nd at 3:58 am
Unless you have been drunk before you will understand. When you have been drunk so much until you become unconscious-after a while- although still drunk ,you somehow get yourself out of that unconscious state and do things and say things that you do not remember the next day. Do not act like this never happens. It does. Although the drunk person slurs and vomits all over the place, some people tend to do things that they regret the next day after someone tells the stupid things they did that night. What these boys did was wrong and they are now punished. The bloggers, “We shouldn’t have to teach them how to stop rape. We need to teach our sons.” is narrow-minded. We ALSO need to include wisdom upon all children and teach everyone including women the dangers of getting yourself in dangerous situations. Not every human has morals like you. You need to protect yourself against harm. Do not intoxicate yourself and think someone will take care of you.
by: Cyn, Mar 22nd at 5:45 am
Inhumane I think is a better description than dumb or stupid. I work with women and whose lives have been painfully affected forever including their families and their future generations. OK, it is not murder, but it most certainly is murder of a part of the soul. Only those who have been raped will understand this painfully dreadful truth.
by: Cristull, Mar 22nd at 7:07 am
Fuck in its literal meaning refers to the act of sexual intercourse. It is an English word that is almost universally considered vulgar. It is often used as a profanity, either to denote disdain or as an intensifier. The use of the F-word in writing about rape is wrong. This is an important subject, the F-word has not place in this conversation.
by: Bill, Mar 22nd at 11:27 am
@ Bill – well gee thanks for the dictionary definition…. not that we didn’t already know it! Guess what, Bill – I DON’T GIVE A FUCK!
by: Mom of Two Boys, Apr 11th at 3:45 pm
Pity.
No…I think we should pity them. What we should not do is allow them to be excused because of that pity.
We should express that pity to them. We should pity them, for being incapable of making a moral judgement. Pity them, for not having sufficient control of themselves not to thrust themselves into an unconcious person. Pity their inability.
And we should make sure they are aware of that pity. That pity should become the dominant factor in their lives.
Wherever these people go, they should be greeted with pity. These are failed human beings. Worse – infintely worse -than those who fail because of their own bodies,who have no choice in the matter and can be lauded for their efforts.
Worse than those that fail because society allows them to be passive.
Pity? They should be pitied. Pity is a fitting judgement. Expressed properly. Expressed as the disdain it can be.
What they should not be is excused. We should not empathise. We should not feel ‘sorry’ for them, should not feel that it is a poor thing for them to have broken themselves so profoundly.
But pity them, indeed. Pity these creatures, until such pride as they can have is withered away.
by: Alastair Meek, Mar 22nd at 3:22 pm
Failed because of their bodies, or their minds? Hmm.
by: A man, Mar 24th at 9:55 am
Agree! I have a son and totally agree!!! Thanks for sharing!
by: Katie, Mar 22nd at 3:57 pm
I have two sons and two daughters and I completely agree. check out this ad campaign.
http://www.upworthy.com/finally-an-anti-rape-campaign-that-isnt-victim-blame-y?g=2&c=bl3
by: Wendy, Mar 22nd at 4:59 pm
Well said and thanks for saying it.
by: Connie McLeod, Mar 22nd at 5:04 pm
Shameful that compassion ceases to be a natural part of ones’ self and has turned into something one must be taught.
by: Lynn, Mar 22nd at 7:35 pm
All I can say is: Yep. The thing is, it’s not a difficult lesson to teach. If you’re raising your kids to be overall decent human beings, it should be really easy to connect those dots.
by: Clark Brooks, Mar 22nd at 7:46 pm
I loved your post and included in this list with 10 others well worth reading: http://amazingwomenrock.com/11-rape-related-blog-posts-worth-reading
by: Susan Macaulay, Mar 22nd at 8:19 pm
I totally agree with you. Men and boys need to respect girls and women. I feel we have let something slip…. Hollywood movies, commercials, etc. women have become objects again rather than real people. Bring back respect for women.
by: Kelly, Mar 22nd at 11:26 pm
I don’t understand this. I didn’t go to church and my Mum never said, ” son, it’s not nice to rape people”. It was very obvious to me and still is that harming another person is not okay, let alone violating one. I think these kids have desensitized themselves to normal human behaviour by the things they watch on the internet. Their own sense of entitlement is off the bloody chart! And are now monsters!
by: colin, Mar 22nd at 11:37 pm
I agree with the post. All children, male or female need to be taught respect. Respect for each other, respect for elders, the homeless, the men and women who fight for our country, and most importantly, our country.
Old world ideals and values have left us and we need to bring them back.
These laws in place making parents unable to disipline their children is the root cause of most of these tragedies. Remember when we were kids and we got our butts kicked from one side of the house to the other? It certainly gave us enough fear to stop and think if anything we were doing was wrong.
We have ignorant laws, backed by an ignorant society.
by: Rick Klein, Mar 22nd at 11:57 pm
>>Old world ideals and values have left us and we need to bring them back.<<
Depends on what you mean by "old world's values". Prudery didn't protect sexual assault victims very well, they rather protected the perpetrators if they preserved their reputable facade. Look at the cases of sexual assaults committed by clerics.
No one would regard the Roman church as a homeland of sexual permissiveness – quite the contrary!
It's not the assaults themselves which are due to today's permissiveness to talk about sexual issues but it's their revelation!
by: Phil Human, Apr 15th at 7:35 pm
As a rape survivor I thank you for speaking out and writing this post. You are spot on. My rape happened on a cool fall night in 1978 in a small rural town. My friend and I walked to the gas station about 6 blocks from her house to get something to eat and drink late one Friday night. On our way back to her house, a group of guys came out of no where and chased us. They caught us and drug us back to a house they were partying at. They were our towns jocks and guys that did good school and went to church. We were both gang raped. Neither of us were drunk but they poured whiskey over our faces and down our throats while a couple held us down and while they took turns raping us. Neither of us were dressed seductively as we were both in jeans and sweatshirts. Because of who these guys were we didn’t report this. They threatened us and we knew the town would believe them over us. I cannot even begin to tell you of the hell both of us have went through after that. We didn’t speak a word of this to each other for years let alone anyone else. A couple people know that this has happened to me but my family does not.
I know the hell this girl will go through. I am so proud of her courage to tell and to seek justice and to do what I didn’t have the guts to do. I have recovered but it took years. When I read of the victim blaming and bashing I think, “this is why I didn’t tell” but still I wish I would have reported it. If I could, I would give this girl a hug and stand by her in support. Thank you for speaking out and giving us a voice!
by: Lori, Mar 23rd at 12:13 am
I was disgusted after watching Poppy Harlow on CNN Sunday AM as they broke into the Morning shows, go on about how emotional the boys apologies were through their tears. Now they’re sorry; after they maintained their innocence right up until they were sentenced. If they were tried in IL they would have been tried as adults and their sentence might be 25+ years. They got off easy. The main reason I watch CNN is b/c I feel they are for the most part fair & balanced as opposed to MSNBC & Fox. On Sunday CNN was not.
by: baaiello, Mar 23rd at 4:53 am
I wish there was a “LIKE” X 1000 for your blog post. It is something I am going to keep for a long time and require all of my kids to read. Yes, it has some swears in it. You know what? Many people swear when they are emotionall and angry. Thank you for sharing your emotions with us, it very may well save a life or at least some poor girl’s dignity.
by: Tim, Mar 23rd at 12:23 pm
While it is important to teach boys not to do it, it is more important to remove the culture of rape in general… I was a male in college that had a female in a position of power who would wait for me to come home to my dorm intoxicated so she could take advantage of me in a state where I couldn’t say no. Due to the stigmas associated with men never being the victim this is the first time I have ever told this story in a way that truly revealed how used, degraded and horrible the situation made me feel. As someone else pointed out 91% of rape cases the victim is female and 9% are male… while it is horrible that this is the case perhaps it does not reflect the true amount of males who have felt victimized by females since it does not fit into our culture for males to show weakness or to not want sex. Even though I was able to say this hear, I still will not come out and say it to my friends or family or even my fiancee for fear of how their view of me will change.
by: Anon, Mar 23rd at 2:11 pm
While I can agree that it shouldn’t be entirely upon women to protect themselves from rape I disagree with the sentiment of “teaching boys not to rape”, essentially under the assumption that they are all potential rapists. That would have the same effect as treating all religious leaders as though they were all potential child molesters, breeding mostly contempt and a feeling of persecution, ultimately undermining the good it hoped to do.
Rapists are in the minority, whether among straight or gay, men or women, theist or non-theist, and treating everyone as though they are liable to be something bad will only breed the mentality that they are mistrusted and bad people. As one you punk I saw recently on a scared straight program said: “if i’m going to be treated like a punk, I’ve got nothing to lose by acting like one.”
That being said, what we DO need to do is teach people, all people, to stand up for what is right and recognize when a crime is being committed. Time and time again you hear stories in the news of people standing by and doing nothing while crimes they know to be happening and know to be wrong occur. Whether rape or robbery, domestic abuse or insider trading, child molestation or shop lifting, it is the inaction of good people (the majority) who allow the actions of bad people (the minority) to occur unopposed.
What we need to do is not teach boys not to rape. What we need to do is teach boys not to be accepting of rape. You can control your own children, yes, but there are those out there who have parents who contributed very little to their moral character. What needs to be taught is to recognize what we all know is wrong as wrong and to stand up for what is right and put a stop to it. All the preaching of parents and community leaders probably wouldn’t have stopped the first boy raping the girl in steubenville, but one boy taught to take a stand against what he knows as injustice, instead of giving in to peer pressure, or turning a blind eye, could have put a stop to everything that happened after the initial crossing of the line of non-consent.
We don’t need to treat people like potential criminals, we need to treat them like potential saviors.
by: Georg, Mar 23rd at 2:39 pm
I am the mother of a teenage daughter. Thank you for this post.
by: AnonyMOM, Mar 23rd at 3:53 pm
It isn’t just about teaching respect it about not making excuses for bad behavior. I see too often mothers in particular defending their sons no matter how abusive and how reckless they are. These 20+ year old guys still living at home, chasing after 14 year old girls is enabled by the mothers of these delinquents. While girls do need to be taught how to avoid dangerous situations, parents need to stop condoning the YOLO mentality that breeds this. You may only live once but that life does not have to be used up in two decades.
by: John Kane, Mar 23rd at 4:17 pm
No it’s not fair. But you HAVE to raise children who go into situations knowing full well the potential ugliness that human beings are capable of. I’d rather have my kids decide to attend (or not attend)a party knowing full well that there will be at least one amoral jerk just waiting for someone, male OR female, to get trashed to helplessness so the violating can begin. Will the party be as fun for them if they have to remember those odious tips for safety and perhaps babysit some of their friends who don’t abide by those tips? Probably not. But I’d rather that than have them carry around a lifetime of scars and baggage from an opportunistic crime committed against them or their friends.
by: JMatter, Mar 23rd at 4:45 pm
I couldn’t agree with you more. And as the Mother of 3 girls, I truly appreciate your teachings to your boys. I hate the idea of the feeling that I have to teach my girls “not to get raped”. What I plan to actually do is to empower them.
I’ve also blogged about this: http://randomslate.wordpress.com/2013/03/20/a-mens-issue-mens-violence-against-women/
by: RandomSlate, Mar 23rd at 6:53 pm
Right on!!!! Can’t believe people feel sorry for these guys.
by: GJ, Mar 23rd at 6:59 pm
I agree 100%. Your passion about this is appreciated. I feel this way about bullying, too; why do we invest all of ur energies into being reactive instead of fixing what’s causing the problem.
by: mrs4444, Mar 23rd at 7:37 pm
Agreed. As a mother of a daughter who was raped at 16 by a 26 year old, I can only emphasize the extreme importance of teaching them what to do if they are raped. Go IMMEDIATELY to a hospital. Because unless the bastard’s friends are filming it, he probably won’t end up in jail. And I also have three boys who were taught respect, kindness and justice. They stepped in where the law failed us.
by: Norcom1013, Mar 24th at 4:34 pm
I didn’t have the heart to make it thru a lot of the back and forth in the comments, but thank you for this post. I needed it.
This has been a difficult story to watch unfold, and I’m still trying to make sense of it as a mother of a 5-year-old girl and another girl on the way. I recently wrote a blog post on how I’m responding to it at home with my girl, but I read your post first and I needed to hear that perspective, so thank you again.
by: Kelly, Mar 25th at 12:12 pm
I could not agree with you more! A woman should be allowed to wear what she wants when she wants and not worry about being raped. It is not the girls fault, they don’t ask for it. Who would ask to genuinely be raped, mistreated and used in such a way.
It’s making me crazy that the fact that pictures of the poor girl being raped were posted and she was bullied, and nothing was being done about it.
Women should not have to be scared, men should be taught better.
by: Nicole, Apr 9th at 10:16 pm
Did you read all the post? The “instructions” given in the first rows are just examples for those instructions given to young girls, charging them with the responsability for not being raped.
This is which this article turns against. It says that, regardless of the girl’s improvidence, a rape is still 100% the perpetrator’s fault.
by: Phil Human, Apr 15th at 7:07 pm
This was well written and exactly what needed to be said. CNN is a disgrace to show support to rapist! I will be making a trip to their Facebook next! I don’t know when it became cool for a group of ppl to do this to another human being but I do know it is continuing bc their is no punishment for it. The all need to be punished for their actions, then maybe they won’t do it again. The parents of the boys should be ashamed to be defending them too.
by: Kelly, Apr 9th at 11:43 pm
I to was a survior of rape in a time when things just went away ,well it doesnt go away ,,,whispers at school ,name calling ,public slammings was hard ……and nothing done by parens or police ,,,,,,flash ahead 35 years guess what only thing thas changed is there now is facebook and everyone has cell phone …..society needs to change till then boys will be boys ,girls will be blamed and vs situations and yes i’m a mom with 2 grown boys and grow daughthers i had all the talks and told them my story 2 of mine where still sexally assulted in high school so i know how it is on both sides and my boys deal with not being able to protect them …people forget its a communitty that hurts and sometimes forever ,,
by: cathy, Apr 10th at 2:32 am
We have to teach our daughters to be safe, as simple as that…..because there are parents who do not teach their sons to be respectful of girls/women. People may be disheartened by having to do that…..but we live in this real world, and absolutely must do that. I have 2 girls and 2 boys and we talk about everything that encourages quality, pride, and self-esteem in their choices/decisions. Tragic happenings will always occur, but our children may be safer if we educate them on how to safe guard themselves. We cannot live in a bubble. I so wish we could.
by: Lisa, Apr 10th at 1:29 pm
Rape has little to do with sex. It is about aggression and control and subjugation. And I agree that the emphasis should not be more on teaching girls how not to get raped, but rather on boys not to commit rape or any kind of sexual assault or unwanted contact in the first place. It reminds me of those cultures where women are compelled to wear complete body covers rather than telling the men to keep their hands and penises to themselves. It’s kind of pathetic when we as men say, “Rape is women’s fault because they tempt us.” Really? That’s all it takes? You do have not even one iota of self-control? What horse shit! It’s like saying, “Shoplifting is the stores’ fault because they have PRODUCTS.” Imagine a judge saying to the store owner, “Well, what did you expect, displaying your wares so prominently? Being so well stocked?” It’s bloody Ridiculous. Boys and Men: these are our DAUGHTERS, GIRLFRIENDS, WIVES, NIECES, MOTHERS … Smarten the fuck UP.
by: Kim Dunn O'Brien, Apr 10th at 3:33 pm
Check this link out! We need more of this… https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=514450048601993&set=vb.210006089066574&type=2&theater
by: Derek, Apr 10th at 6:10 pm
http://www.buzzfeed.com/ryanhatesthis/outrage-erupts-online-over-17-year-old-girls-suicide-after-h
this is local and it is horrendous. Also, partners, if you are married and you are drunk and passed out, your partner does not have the right to have sex with you without your consent.
by: Identity Crisis, Apr 10th at 10:02 pm
If the guys got a beard yank hard and fast up wards, it hurts them bad, Also one great way to get them bent and moaning and ready to knee or kick where it hurts too. But we woman shouldn’t have to learn these things. Doesn’t hurt to though. I wasn’ 100 lbs he was 250. a foot taller…. I laid him out . left him moaning on the pavement.
by: diane, Apr 11th at 12:32 pm
Amen! I am unfortunately raising a daughter, but I was raised very much as you were. This article is incredible and I am going to re-post it immediately!
Until parents teach their sons, until parents accept some responsibility for teaching their sons right from wrong, our society is doomed.
Consequences, we speak that word freely yet when it comes down to it, few are forced to accept the consequences of their own actions.
by: Arline Pelton, Apr 11th at 12:40 pm
This is brilliant and I wish more people raised their sons the way you are raising them!!!!
by: Anne, Apr 11th at 1:24 pm
Yes, teach the sons and daughters compassion for others. I think also importantly is to teach them how to use technology with compassion for others. Technology got away from all of us before we ever knew the hidden dangers. Easy access to porn and posting anything you want about someone has de-sensitized and demoralized a whole generation. Sex is a party’game’ nowadays, and I use that term extremely loosely. My generation’s party game was spin the bottle.
I am worried for future generations of this world. I still believe there is more good than bad and the focus for teaching should include using technology with respect.
by: Marilyn Boyd, Apr 11th at 1:45 pm
You nailed it, ty, and now I suppose you will get looked at differently for swearing….very good tho, and I totally agree with you….more should raise sons like ours.
by: shirley cameron, Apr 11th at 2:37 pm
Hi.
An excellent blog, I am in complete agreement with the sentiments.
I am a male. I have two sons. I have two daughters. None of them are of the opinion that rape is okay, the woman’s fault or anything else that heaps blame on the woman (in the case of female rape) or perhaps I should more appropriately say “person”.
It is not rocket science for parents to teach their kids to have a very simple respect for other people as well as themselves. It is not difficult to teach kids that the world does not revolve around the “me” in them. But that they have an responsibility and accountability to others for their own actions.
I think a large portion of blame lies in an almost global attitude of self importance and significance. Too much emphasis on self gratification. And this focus on self is at the cost of thinking of others. A simple enough lesson in itself to teach children.
I’m not talking of some kind of walk-the-earth Zen’ism. Just a straightforward and simple realisation, recognition and promotion that people (male and female) should have and hold a basic respect for each other at all times.
There. It isn’t that difficult, is it?
by: Danny UK, Apr 11th at 2:48 pm
As the parent of two incredibly respectful sons who know how to treat women and who are sickened by events such as what happened to Rehtaeh Parsons, I think more parents of sons need a slap ’round the face to wake up to how they are failing their boys if they still think girls are just pretty toys there for them to try to screw! It’s time that all boys knew without asking – unless “yes” is coming from her lips – that’s a “no”! I just don’t know how the parents of these rapists can live with themselves for raising their kids in such a way that they think it’s perfectly okay – funny, in fact – to rape!
by: Mom of Two Boys, Apr 11th at 3:04 pm
You are so right! I am blogging about this and quoting you; it will be online soon if you want to take a look.
by: HappinessSavouredHot, Apr 11th at 3:09 pm
I am reposting a quote from this on my blog. Great post! We need to hear more of that.
by: HappinessSavouredHot, Apr 11th at 3:14 pm
At first I had a “WHOH THERE” response to the title. But as I read on, you have the right attitude. I was taught by my father to respect women, and I have taught my son (as best I can, and I have full confidence in him) to do the same. I, as a male, find rape far more disgusting than any other form of horror. But the point is each real man will encounter every woman knowing they don’t have to worry about raping them, every woman has to worry about each and every man because the danger is there with one out of hundreds they will meet. We need stronger punishments to reassure the victims that they are more important than the monsters, and some monsters will think twice before acting, but we can’t stop teaching our daughters to avoid trouble, fight back, and demand respect. We need to raise both stronger ladies and more respectful gentlemen.
by: Waylon, Apr 11th at 3:17 pm
so very well said………
by: Valarie, Apr 11th at 3:44 pm
Bang on. Well said.
by: Julia Kent @ The Domestic Blonde, Apr 11th at 4:16 pm
It appears the mother of Rehtaeh Parson has shared this article on her tribute page to her late daughter. Rehtaeh recently committed suicide after months of struggling with the trauma of being gang raped at a party, photographed, bullied and let down by the justice system.
This is the perfect response to rape.
My only thought on these cases has always been, “How can you raise a boy who participates in such a vile act OR stands by and lets it happen?”
by: CattieS, Apr 11th at 4:26 pm
I have twins 1 girl 1 boy, that you for reminding me that while I am teaching my daughter I need to talk to my son too. I have not thought about it, but i need to. Maybe some good will come out of your statement, it does take a man to rape, so you are correct 100%.
by: melissa, Apr 11th at 5:36 pm
Seems pretty straightforward to me. Let’s see, I’m a white middle-aged heterosexual reasonably well-to-do man and I apparently wasn’t taught growing up that rape was acceptable. I am not even sure that I was taught that it was necessarily wrong. It just wasn’t part of the discussion and therefore not even in the spectrum of possible behaviours. Perhaps the general conversation of “loving relationship” or “consenting fun” was all I heard and I was smart enough to fill in the blanks for myself: respect is good, rape would therefore have to be bad. A woman’s body is her own, not mine, and I have no right to it. Nor do I (or anyone else for that matter) have any sort of privilege with regard to sex. Given that I have a perfectly functional Y chromosome, I can’t come to any conclusion other than “rape culture” is taught… by family, by peers, and via the pervasive bath of media we find ourselves in (which as far as I’m concerned is the family’s job to moderate). I’m glad you were able to put to words (some of them appropriately colourful) the way many of us feel about the terrifying view into Western civilization that we were given via the Steubenville rape trial, and the opinions that have been voiced as a result. P.S. Good call on the “comment moderation policy”.
by: PF, Apr 11th at 6:03 pm
I’m a teacher and on a trip with students I was molested and robed by a two men on a bus. The other teachers expected me to only talk of the theft, as if I had to be ashamed for the more ‘traumatic’ part of the bustrip. Any boy or girl who asked me what happened, got the whole story. This just to say: talk about it. And thank you.
by: Anne, Apr 11th at 6:55 pm
Most of your article made sense, but you started off with something that will only confuse your boys and others, and that is that it’s the girl/woman’s duty to avoid rape. Of course, all parties how part to play in protecting their own safety, but at no time is it acceptable for a boy or a man to rape a a girl/woman. End a story. I don’t care if she shows up nude at an orgy, if she says no, or any of the other equivalents to no that you brilliantly spelled out, then it’s hands-off for any boy or man… or woman for that matter. We have to get out of the mindset that the girl/woman was fully or partly responsible. No one is forcing these boys/men to rape anyone, as that is their decision and their’s only. So stop sending out conflicting statements which undermine your true feeling that boys/men should stop raping anyone.
by: Dave Davis, Apr 11th at 7:03 pm
While I agree with the sentiment of the article, the simple reality is that we need to do both. Yes, teach your sons to respect others and to protect those in need. But also teach your daughters to avoid putting themselves as risk if they can avoid it.
by: John, Apr 11th at 7:17 pm
I agree, but it’s important to add that whenever they fall victims of a rape, it’s 100% their rapist’s fault, not theirs, regardless of whether they had taken all precautions they could or not.
“Putting yourself in danger” often simply means trusting someone of whom you don’t perfectly know that he/she is really trustworthy – but can you really know anyone enough to know it?
Additionally, we need to be able to trust each other, at least to some degree. We rely on other people too much for being able to regard everyone else as a potential enemy, perhaps robber, rapist or murderer. A life in such a world were not worth living, I think.
by: Phil Human, Apr 15th at 6:52 pm
I agree that we need to teach our children regardless of sex that no only does “no mean no”, there are so many other possibilities that definitely mean NO. A male member of family was raped by a woman. And I was raped by a male family member. I understand that it is usually men raping women according to statistics, but many men do not report being raped. We need to teach our children, end of story. I loved this blog post, so honest and so RIGHT!
by: mary, Apr 11th at 8:04 pm
EXACTLY! I am so outraged again about a rape and the devastating ripple effect – about what happened to this precious beautiful young girl Rahtaeh!!! So many people did let her down- colluding with her rapists to her demise.Every harsh spoken word towards her, the parents of these people that did not stop and teach their kids to be kind to her. Her teachers especially-her school, her principal. The poor action ripples to my home today and I am also feeling huge despair because of the rapes and her subsequent death from them. I will spend another full day searching the net about this with my son who is 19, sharing with him the pain just like i did with the Steubenville case. I participated in one Billion Rising on Vday, trying to make awareness happen. I love this blog post- Thank you for using your voice to show love for Rahtaeh and her family.JUSTICE IS WHAT I WANT TO SEE HAPPEN NOW! Also- I am so glad Annonymous is involved- please keep being in the stroy annonymous you are making a difference!
by: Rebekah Becky Majors-Manley, Apr 11th at 8:15 pm
I was standing and cheering by the time I finished this blog. Thank you for saying what needs to be said so candidly.
by: Jacqueline, Apr 11th at 8:20 pm
Idealistically, I agree 100% but this is not a perfect world we live in and to believe otherwise is to invite trouble. Boys and Men who do rape women are seldomly the result of bad parenting or poor education. There is fundamentally something wrong with them. If you will, compare this to crossing the street. One could argue, I am sick of telling my children to look both ways before crossing the street. Drivers should be taught to be more attentive and respectful of pedestrians. In a perfect world, this would work. However in our world, you walk into the street without looking you may just get smacked my someone who simply doesn’t care. Sad, but unfortunately true.
by: Lee, Apr 11th at 8:59 pm
Absolutely correct, Lee.
by: Kevin D., Apr 12th at 4:41 pm
You shouldn’t equalize things that are perfectly inequal indeed. A car driver doesn’t WANT to hit a pedestrian, it’s even far from his/her natural interest, and a thoughtful car driver will let you cross the street if you show you want to. When you are already doing so, even a reckless driver will hoot and perhaps curse you because you make him/her brake for you but he/she normally won’t simply overrun you deliberately.
The buck of avoiding collisions stops with both the driver AND the pedestrian in principle.
Unlike accidents such as collisions, rapes are always deliberate. In the issue of rape, there is no “sorry, I couldn’t react quick enough, it was too late to move out of her way”.
In some thing you’re right: You can’t trust all people, there ARE some villains among them, and so, it’s wise to take some precautions for lowering the risk of becoming a victim because being in the right AS a victim is a poor alternative for not even falling victim at all.
However, this still implies that the victim of a violent felony is in the right anyway and no one has the right to give him/her even the least peace of join guilt, let alone take it from the perpetrator.
by: Phil Human, Apr 15th at 6:35 pm
Spot fucking on. I do have a daughter. She’s 9. She’s been in martial arts for 3 years and she loves it. I do talk to her about this and just today I said. ” I’ll tell you this as many times as you need to hear it- you do whatever you have to to protect yourself and your friends. It’s very sad but there are bad people out there and you guys have to look out for each other”
by: Chuck, Apr 11th at 9:21 pm
PLEASE put this in a video, so it can be shown everywhere. This message should even be shown as part of Sex Ed in schools! (And yes, I am dead serious. You go, girl!)
by: Stephanie J, Apr 11th at 10:02 pm
I agree with every single word of this post. Teaching boys (and girls, for that matter) is the key to stop violence. However, as a mother of three little guys (all under 6) I’m wondering how will I do that? How can I really teach them that the only option is to respect everybody? I’ll start by beaing, myself, respectful, but for the rest I’m still searching
by: Wistiti, Apr 12th at 12:08 am
Well said. Glad someone said it!
by: Heather, Apr 12th at 3:55 am
A week ago today, a beautiful 17 year old girl named Rehtaeh Parsons hung herself after enduring over a year of harassment and bullying after being raped by 4 boys in Nova Scotia Canada. At the time, the Crown decided that there was not enough evidence to bring the case to trial. It took the RCMP 10 months to even talk to these boys!!! They too, had posted photos on social media. Rehtaeh, changed schools and made a few new friends but she could not escape the torment. One week ago, she hung herself in her bathroom. Her Mother found her, cut her down and they rushed her to hospital. They took her off life support on Sunday evening. Her funeral is tomorrow. HER story has now captured National & International (CNN) attention but it has come too late for this beautiful girl!! We have 2 girls and 2 boys ourselves and it is sad that we even have to have the conversations that we have these days. Parents, please teach your children to respect themselves AND others!!! RIP Rehteah, may your life not be in vain.
by: Jennifer, Apr 12th at 11:42 am
Although I agree with the argument in principle, it will also be necessary to continue teaching kids (all kids) ways to best prevent & escape violent attacks such as rape. This may anger many parents out there, but keep in mind, the primary objective is to ensure they can tend to their personal safety at all times in all places throughout their lifetime. The reality is that not all parents raise their children properly or teach them the values and lessons necessary to completely wipe out this type of violent behaviour (or worse). While I completely agree kids should be taught not to rape and to respect boundaries, etc., we cannot assume it will lead to absolute prevention. Also, let’s not kid ourselves, there are female rapists out there too. Just because we don’t hear about them in the media nearly as often, doesn’t mean they don’t exist. This is not and should not be considered a gender-exclusive issue.
by: Kevin D., Apr 12th at 3:40 pm
Incredibly well written!
by: Wanky, Apr 12th at 9:57 pm
Thank-you! Rape culture is learned and legitimized, it does not simply exist and as such it can be unlearned and delegistimized.
by: WA, Apr 12th at 10:17 pm
Perfect. Absolutely. In light of the recent publicized rapes – I’ve realized that I’ve been teaching my son not to rape for a couple years already – without even thinking about cases like these. I’ve been teaching him to be open, and caring and compassionate. And he is. Our kids can be taught compassion for one another. We just have to do it.
One other thing…
My son isn’t a “house party” type of fellow – however – he may be at some point, so I’ve also taught him *not* to be the guy who gets stabbed while trying to break up a fight. He knows that if any situation is out of control – he needs to quickly step away and call 911.
We need to talk to our children. It’s easy. Do it from when they’re small. I have been – and my son is very open and honest. It’s not difficult. It’s parenting.
by: Jo, Apr 13th at 12:14 am
Why is everyone acting like rape is new, and only now do people care? It pisses me off to no end to have people act like now they are allowed to be appalled after all the horrific acts commited in their lifetimes. Where the hell have you been?! Rape sucks, its horrible. No one should have to deal with that. That said, the responsibility is on both halves. One to avoid natural predators ( we are all animals, just civilized for the most part ) and 2 to be a decent enough human being to stop when its wrong. Bleeding hearts on the internet rarely do a god damn thing about it in real life. Good job posting on an obscure website about a subject you might actually affect if you got off your ass and did something.
done.
by: Confused Guy, Apr 13th at 6:40 am
This is so well-articulated, I wish I had written it. I couldn’t agree with you more, and I share your horror at how the media has portrayed Stubenville. It doesn’t matter how much she has had to drink, how she chose to dress, whether or not she made promiscuous comments earlier in the night. She’s a human being and what those boys did was inhumane. Rape is inhumane in any form.
by: Larry, Apr 13th at 5:58 pm
As has been said before,it all comes down to parenting. As a mother of 5 grown children, RESPECT for all others and property was ingrained in all of them. And, has paid off in terms of the adults they’ve become.
As a victim I will never tolerate any joking or reference to the idea of rape which in my book is ALWAYS a crime.
The idea of parents in Steubenville proving alcohol and party space for high school students is also criminal. No one seemed to point that out during the trial or press coverage and it is evidently condoned by most. Those teens went driving from house to house throughout the night without any adult questioning their behavior or whereabouts. Drinking, driving, raping and who knows what else. Inexcusable! How can we possibly expect these teens to behave appropriately when they have absolutely no adult role models.
Oh, and then there’s the coverup for the “sake of the football team.” Talk about skewed values and morals.
What will it take for America to wake up???
by: Susan, Apr 14th at 2:47 am
So good to see a post saying what any right minded parent has been saying for the last 30/40 years, basic value`s have been underminded initially through latch key children without parental guidence, who then had children of their own, its past time to take stock of where we are and what so many men & women lost their lives for in defence of Western Ideology; We have developed a nation where nihilism abounds creating despair to the existential thinking that followed WW2, Bring back the birch I say …..[Sic`]
by: Tom Jeacock, Apr 16th at 12:45 pm
As a guy who has suffered through the traumatic experience of being raped, I have to say I think we should teach everyone to just be nice and not do heinous things. Simple enough, right?
by: anonymoususer, Apr 16th at 8:00 pm
The rest of this article is great, but to think that it’s not one’s responsibility to teach their kids how to stay safe in every area of their life, and that it should be SOMEONE ELSE’s responsibility to teach everyone else that, is wreckless. Where else does this work in life? Dont worry about keeping a fire extinguisher in your house, its the HOUSE’S job to not catch on fire? Dont worry about driving defensivly and accounting for other’s mistakes before they make them? People in this litigious society need to realize a settlement check isnt going to give you your innocence back, nor magically erase that fact you’re a quadriplegic.
by: Theblackknight, Apr 27th at 11:06 pm
I truly appreciate your post. My daughter was a victim of rape and sodomy last week. She is 15. She walked home with a boy for lunch to hang out. She thought he was gonna ask her to prom. When he was done raping her he left the room saying “I’m gonna play x-box, see ya” She walked back to school crying, in shock and alone. She knew she made a poor decision to go to his house, but that’s where it stops being her fault and becomes a horrible act on the boys behalf. He’s 18 and was arrested 2 days ago, the same day we found out about my daughters rape. I am sick, sad, angry, numb and absolutely fed up with the world’s ways. Sexualising everything and making men and women (mostly woman) nothing but “holes” and play things to dispose of. Thank you for your post. I’m not one to cuss much but you couldn’t have expressed yourself and the way I feel any more perfectly.
by: Brokenheartedandpissed, May 5th at 3:38 am
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SlutWalk
A movement happening in cities all over showing just what you are saying. Teach “Don’t Rape” not ‘Don’t Get Raped.” Clothes and appearances are not consent.
by: Elaina, May 7th at 4:27 am
So true, our country has lost respect for life as well as each other.
by: Momma of 3, Mar 19th at 11:03 am
This has nothing to do with abortion. These are 2 separate and entirely different issues. Find another article to comment on because I think you got a little lost in your google search today.
by: Kate, Mar 19th at 12:53 pm
And as soon as it doesn’t need another beating heart to survive, then it is a baby.
by: Nell, Mar 21st at 9:02 pm
Drinking and passing out is no excuse.
This girl didn’t “get drunk and give it up” She was unconscious.
There is no apology to be made. The boys are pigs of the worst type. They took advantage of a situation and destroyed a life.
The fact that their lives are also pretty much destroyed is of small consolation. It’s a good thing to have to live with the damage you did forever. They now have a lovely sex-offender label to wear for the rest of their lives.
If you ask me, it’s too damned good for them.
by: ShredderFeeder, Mar 19th at 6:22 pm
Personally, I think tweedle-dee and tweedle-dumbass should be castrated and forced to spend their lives getting raped by other prisoners.
*THAT* is an appropriate punishment for rape.
by: ShredderFeeder, Mar 19th at 6:26 pm
Rene, you are part of the problem. Victim blaming from the ignorant or morally ambiguous.
In any case, the truth always comes out. Your argument is invalid.
I pray that you (or your daughter) are never someone’s victim… lest you get the same blame.
by: Dahna, Mar 19th at 8:53 pm
These boys did not lie, there are videos. Is there something wrong with your eyes and ears, as well as your reasoning?
by: Sue, Mar 22nd at 3:15 am
Castrating Juveniles who grew up in a town that enables rapes? What is wrong with you? Rape is not okay, and I don’t think anyone knows exactly what happened at that party, but the fact is that they raped a passed out girl. But castration??? Whats wrong with you?
by: Ashamed of our country, Mar 19th at 8:53 pm
Thank God that you have no moral authority.
by: A man, Mar 24th at 9:58 am
Oh what a load of rape apologist bullshit that is. This is so typical, a terrible gang rape has happened and rape apologists instantly start talking about false allegations.
There are hardly ANY false allegations of rape. The general figure is quoted at about 2-4%, slightly lower than false allegations of some other crimes. A recent study by the Crown Prosecution Service in England and Wales put it at 0.6%. But 1 in 4 women get raped or sexually assaulted in their lives and only 10-15% report. Of those who do report, only 6% see their rapist found guilty. That’s the context. Which do you think is more of a problem? The 25% of women who are raped or the miniscule number of false allegations? The mountain or the anthill?
The idea that women can just say they’re raped and everyone believes them, is total bollocks. The automatic, kneejerk reaction to an allegation of rape, is disbelief. That’s why 85-90% if if those raped, don’t report. The belief that false allegations are a serious problem, is simply a misogynist myth: men invented it in order to get away with raping women and mostly it’s still working for them. Even when men or boys get found guilty of rape, men can’t resist talking about false allegations, just to remind us that it’s only a one-off.
As for saying that girls need to be held responsible for rape too – er, no, the only people who are responsible for it, are the people who choose to do it. Girls aren’t responsible for someone else’s behaviour, only their own.
by: herbsandhags, Mar 19th at 9:34 pm
Absolutely. And not just the balls, the whole package.
They’re not “Juveniles” anymore. They’re RAPISTS. Tried and convicted.
Even in prison, rapists are the lowest form of life. That’s for good reason.
THEY ARE.
by: ShredderFeeder, Mar 20th at 1:55 pm
Are you sure about that?
It’s been my experience that where there’s smoke, there’s usually fire.
Maybe your son should have been a little more careful who he hung out with. Maybe he asked for it. Maybe he brought it on himself because of how he was dressed or how drunk he got.
by: ShredderFeeder, Mar 20th at 1:58 pm
Where he was or who he was with just doesn’t make anymore sense than blaming a girl for the way she was dressed or if she was drunk. It’s the same thing. All I am not defending rapists here, the boys in this particular case or any stupid reasons like the way a girl was dressed as cause for her to be raped. I don’t think that way. You don’t even know my story or my sons. My point to this article was all about the fact that I think both genders need to be educated. How can you dismiss that and know blame my son. Girls do things wrong to. Read some of the other comments read the comment from the woman who worked with girls that told her they would or had lied about rape. Especially this day and age girls are not so innocent anymore. They do lie and honestly if you feel that strongly about rape don’t you realize that these girls that lie how much they are hurting true victims. Your response really is completely unfair.
by: Rene Glosny, Mar 20th at 4:18 pm
Yes, so unfair that we actually ask boys to take responsibility for once. Also, what you said about girls being automatically believed about being raped is just not true. Very few rapes are even reported, and in those that are, the victim is often blamed for the crime. Also, people like you will jump up and accuser of bringing forth false accusations because you believing in protecting sons at all costs, but not daughters. I am sorry if your son was falsely accused but that’s not what this conversation is about. It’s about putting a stop to real attacks and not placing stigma on victims.
by: Red Bird, Mar 20th at 6:15 pm
thank you so much for sharing this. and for speaking out on this.
by: Rene Glosny, Mar 20th at 9:59 pm
you talk too much
by: Peggy, Mar 21st at 3:21 am
“women also need to step and take responsibility. Again emphasis is being put on the BOYS in this article when it should be put on both parties”
Rene, the reason this article focuses on male responsibility is b/c the overwhelming majority of preventative measures in the mainstream media are directed at females. This article is providing the counterbalance to what is already out there, so you’re missing the point with this comment.
“There are hardly ANY false allegations of rape.”
Oooh, that’s not helping, herbasandhags. One false rape accusation causes skepticism to outweigh sympathy toward 10 actual rape victims. So even if there are very few false rape accusations, the damage they cause is exponentially worse. While this is true w/in the context of rape culture, we aren’t going to fix that by dismissing an unfair but powerful reality.
by: Just a guy, Mar 21st at 1:05 pm
But see, the problem is, no one has really stood up for rape victims until now. There have been plenty of people like you who will speak out for “the falsely accused” but not many people who will stand up for those who have suffered sexual assault. Who do you think so few rape cases make it to court? Hardly any rapists that get prosecuted? Because of people like you who scream “false accuser!” and people who tell the victim that her rape was her fault. People like those CNN anchors that lament about the poor rapists lives were ruined. This kind of thing needs to stop. I think perhaps you have missed the entire point. If you want a forum for false accusations I suggest you look elsewhere. Otherwise you are really just being a troll here.
by: Red Bird, Mar 21st at 2:16 pm
In any case, Rene, I think you really really really need to read this: http://rantagainsttherandom.wordpress.com/2013/03/20/why-i-wont-publish-your-comments-about-false-rape-accusations/
by: Red Bird, Mar 21st at 3:17 pm
Please look at this infographic about false rape accusations: http://www.slate.com/blogs/xx_factor/2013/01/08/the_enliven_project_s_false_rape_accusations_infographic_great_intentions.html
Yes lying about rape is horrible but it’s so incredibly rare that it’s completely pointless to go on about how false accusations are such a huge problem that needs to be addressed. Nobody wants to go through the stigma and humiliation of being known as rape victim. It’s an awful experience. The only women who lie about it are absolutely batshit insane and I’m sure they come to regret it when they learn that everybody blames the victim anyway. By carrying on about this nonissue, you are just detracting from the very real issue of rape.
by: padme, Mar 22nd at 2:43 am